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whitebaron

ANSWERED:Why do we sort?

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Voted for "I want to have the dragons together that "belong" together". Kind of.

 

Eggs and growing hatchlings go first, so I can see their number and stage.

The adults are sorted by names, and there are two groups: a very special dragons dedicated to my friends (so far 13 dragons), and the rest (over 800 already? Wow).

And then these over 800 dragons are sorted by breeds and gender - but still in alphabetical order.

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I voted other because for me, it's a mix of several different things.

 

First of all, I do put the same breeds together, CBs before lineaged ones, females before males (if the sprites are different).

 

My breeds start with holidays (Xmas, Val, Halloween) and are sorted after the year of release. (Thus, my hollies come first...)

 

However, the dragons I need for community projects are on top of the Holidays, as is my sole 2nd gen Thuwed. smile.gif

 

After the holiday dragons, I put my metals, and then I do some kind of rainbow sort. (Hmm, still need to do something about my glory drakes...) Pygmies are last, and again in some kind of rainbow sort Fashion.

 

So, I have dragons of the same breed together, but I use naming schemes to see which dragons "belong" together for breeding Projects and the like. And my "best" dragons are showcased. Kind of. With a "Little showcase" for each breed.

 

Edit: Please forgive capital letters in strange places. I'm using a PC that's not my own and has a strange auto-correct Feature that puts a capital letter at the beginning of half my words. :/

 

So, apart from the top, my whole scroll looks nice (to me)

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I ended up voting for other. As none of the other options really described how I sort. I sort by favorites, Terrae's are one of my favorites so they stay towards the top, while dragons I don't care for like balloons, I put towards the bottom. Then dragons get sorted by mates, for example, I have a CB black and alt sweetling that are meant as forever mates for each other, those go next to each other. And on top of that, I have a lineage project I worked on awhile ago that I refuse to separate because I like being able to find all the mates for the lineage all next to each other. and yeps, that is basically how I sort my scroll or at least until lately, I've gotten lazy because it takes to long to organize my scroll one dragon at a time.

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I voted "other".

I have my Prized Dragon at the top of my scroll, the trade-able dragons, then New release dragons, non-tradeable dragons, then my word-code dragons and their babies. Then i have my dragons with descriptions, then my metals, and its free-for-all after that but sorted by breed.

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I just want a default setting that can sort dragons by species i.e. you can rank species in the order you want them to appear in.

Yes. This.

 

Though I'd also like to be able to specify certain things - CB's above lineaged, frozen hatchies above or below adults, etc - within each breed. Though that's a fair bit more complex.

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I voted 'I want to have the dragons together that "belong" together' because that's one of the main considerations, the other is being able to find dragons for breeding, and I also want my scroll to look nice. It's a mix of many reasons, with the one I voted for slightly more important (finding dragons for breeding is very important but I use naming more than sorting for that purpose).

 

I just want a default setting that can sort dragons by species i.e. you can rank species in the order you want them to appear in.

 

Oh, and that sounds nice! biggrin.gif

Ever since we got the biomes I wished there was an easy way to sort dragon types according to biome.

Edited by dustpuppy

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I just want a default setting that can sort dragons by species i.e. you can rank species in the order you want them to appear in.

That's a good idea, I would be interested in having it implemented too. It would make it much easier for me to sort my dragons by biome.

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I sort because I like things in order. I would just use normal breed sort, but I like to have it as

 

male adults

female adults

male hatchie

female hatchie

ungen. hatchie

 

too, so I need to manual sort.

 

 

Yes. This.

 

Though I'd also like to be able to specify certain things - CB's above lineaged, frozen hatchies above or below adults, etc - within each breed. Though that's a fair bit more complex.

*cough*gender*cough*

Edited by dracocharky

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I like things where they belong. A shield dragon first (my first dragon, and "protector" of the eggs); then eggs, then hatchlings, then a pillow dragon. Next BSA dragons, sorted by type, then lineages (split by other dragons as necessary for clarity), then miscellaneous dragons.

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I sort my eggs and hatchlings at the top, then the order of age for each dragon/frozen hatchling (oldest at the top, youngest at the bottom), and all the way at the bottom are my test dragons, the ones used for experiments such as lineage patterns.

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I have to say that I don't think there is ANY one solution that will fit everyone. It's about as unlikely as those one size fits all pantyhose - in actual fact they fit no-one !

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Yes. This.

 

Though I'd also like to be able to specify certain things - CB's above lineaged, frozen hatchies above or below adults, etc - within each breed. Though that's a fair bit more complex.

*cough*gender*cough*

Oh, yes, that too. I meant to put gender too. XD

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I have to say that I don't think there is ANY one solution that will fit everyone. It's about as unlikely as those one size fits all pantyhose - in actual fact they fit no-one !

Good then, that this thread is not about solutions. Its about gathering base data to better argue about proposed solutions.

 

Take for example my preferred solution, the tags. Just looking at the poll, we can say that for option 4 it does the trick, for 2 some of them might be content (as for 1) and for the rest (>50%) tags would not change anything related to their sorting woes.

 

Knowing what your stakeholders want is a valuable information, one that should not be underestimated, its why I did this thread - it allows a good base outlook on what the community could need/want without burdening us with the need to find a proper sokution now and that fits everyone.

 

 

---

 

This thread is to me a big success. Lots of information,without clutter, and lots of clues why people argue the way they do, without the need to "win an argument"

Edited by whitebaron

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Good then, that this thread is not about solutions. Its about gathering base data to better argue about proposed solutions.

 

Take for example my preferred solution, the tags. Just looking at the poll, we can say that for option 4 it does the trick, for 2 some of them might be content (as for 1) and for the rest (>50%) tags would not change anything related to their sorting woes.

 

Knowing what your stakeholders want is a valuable information, one that should not be underestimated, its why I did this thread - it allows a good base outlook on what the community could need/want without burdening us with the need to find a proper solution now and that fits everyone.

 

 

---

 

This thread is to me a big success. Lots of information,without clutter, and lots of clues why people argue the way they do, without the need to "win an argument"

Gathering info about solutions is effectively looking for solutions. The tabs thing seems to be what most people want - so ...

 

I'm not looking to win anything. I don't actually have a burning need to sort any further than I do - what I DO want - and MANY others too - is the ability to move blocks of dragons. Much of the need for other sorts would go away if we had that.

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I try to collect one "family" of each breed. One each: Adult male, adult female, male hatchling, female hatchling and unsexed hatchling. So, naturally, I sort them by breed, to display each family together.

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I don't sort that much. I just have my dragons sorted by breed because I don't like them all being mixed together.

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Gathering info about solutions is effectively looking for solutions. The tabs thing seems to be what most people want - so ...

Tags would annoy me to no end, because I'd have to add one or more tags to every dragon I raised. I'd rather just have TABS.. pick the dragon, pick the tab, and done.. no extra effort.

 

I don't need a bunch of keywords and filters to sort my dragons, just nice ordinary pages/tabs to put them on so I can see them all at once.

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I just want a default setting that can sort dragons by species i.e. you can rank species in the order you want them to appear in.

This kind of sorting would requiere not just filtering and\or sorting - it would require database format change a couple of parts in server engine to rewrite.

 

So basically you're talking about a specific sort? Why not just say that?

I was talking from server-side point of view.

 

 

I have to say that I don't think there is ANY one solution that will fit everyone. It's about as unlikely as those one size fits all pantyhose - in actual fact they fit no-one !

Theoretically - you're right. Practically - not so true. Flexible enough system of creating subsets of a full set of dragons + user-driven "weight tables" can create every possible combination.

And with export-import CSV feature this system CAN cover 100% of possible combinations.

 

 

PS. Pls - stop discussing of user interface - think of mechanics!

Tabs & tags are really total equivalents, they only differ in UI.

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PS. Pls - stop discussing of user interface - think of mechanics!

Tabs & tags are really total equivalents, they only differ in UI.

User interface is, at the end of the day, what we will practically see and use. I'm pretty sure TJ can code the site/database however he so wishes, so that shouldn't factor into our consideration of how we want to be able to sort. It shouldn't be us thinking of the mechanics, that's down to TJ. We should be the ones discussing how best we want things to work, then if TJ wishes he can code things that way.

 

And to be honest, I'm sure a lot of people here haven't a clue about what you're talking about when you talk about "user-driven weight tables" "export-import CSV" and all that other server side stuff you mentioned... It's not our job to understand that side of DC, either.

 

 

It would be useful if this thread went back to what was originally intended to be discussed - what users want when we sort our dragons. This is the purpose of this thread, not discussing server side mechanics.

Edited by TheGrox

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All i wanted to say - if we know how it's going on on server - we can choose between fast implementation without many changes in the code and massive rework of such code.

 

PS. Does it really differ how would you switch between your different sortings? menu or tab or dumb select (as it is now)? If it's yes... and not just you, but a majototy of users here.

I'll shut myself up. forever. In this subforum. Nobody cares what i'm talking about, so why would I?

 

(sorry if the following words looks rude. nothing personal)

 

Basically common rule here now - "I don't give a damn about how hard TJ would work. "I want'em all and want it now ©" . Not just in this topic. All that "gimmemore topics". Bang, people, you're so lazy, you don't care. It's ok not to know something, nobody knows everything. Bu some of the frequent posters didn't even give a try.

But what all of you would do if TJ said something like that? Like "I don't care, It works somehow...".

 

PS2Mods: if i breaked some rules - pm me and i'll restrain myself only to trades topics. I'm 95% fine with what we already have.

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I don't think it is a matter of rudeness - but coding and how it would work are down to TJ. He seems to be very good at this stuff, knows what he is doing and discussing coding methods in threads where no-one but you understands the terminology seems - not very useful; we can't respond to you, as we have no idea what you are saying. How he would do it and whether he has faster ways of doing it than anyone here (including you !) can dream of is known only to him.

 

But it might not be hard work at all to him. There are loads of things I can do with my computer that amaze my friends - and I can't understand why it isn't that easy for them. The same may well apply to TJ and coding.

 

This thread was asking what people would like to see, NOT how it could be done. TJ may come in and say he can't or doesn't choose to - but that is up to him. None of us will ever be helping him with the coding, I think.

Edited by fuzzbucket

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But what all of you would do if TJ said something like that? Like "I don't care, It works somehow...".

The purpose of the suggestions forum is to make suggestions. If he didn't want suggestions, he would not have opened a forum with the explicit purpose of creating suggestions and the name of the forum would not be the suggestions forum.

 

When we suggest something, we are not demanding cry babies begging for a feature or a dragon. We are interested in the evolution of the site in the interests of retaining an active userbase - and indeed, a potential consumerbase - for the website's future. None of us would be posting here if we weren't interested in what other people had to say.

 

... and honestly, a 'gimmemore' topics? rolleyes.gif This is hardly a 'gimmemore' topic. A 'gimmemore' topic is one of those 'plz change the raffle and make everyone a winner, kthxbai' threads which popped up recently or the 'more dragons, more often' or the 'NO HOLIDAY LIMITS EVER' or the 'please give me more dragons through hidden biomes' or the 'FREEZING EGGS, WANT' or the 'FASTER eggs, more often' or the 'increase egg limits, hatchy limits pl0x'. You get what I mean. Suddenly, a discussion thread on sorting is indicative of wanting more? blink.gif

 

Bang, people, you're so lazy, you don't care.

I am too lazy to type. Yep. Obviously, if I didn't care, I would not be writing this tedious and long essay.

 

Bu some of the frequent posters didn't even give a try.

I can write up fictitious technobabble as fast as some people here, as with the wonderful graph of the dragon ratios skewing to Apocalyptic Doom (I apologise, but that graph was hyperbolic and in my eyes, completely inaccurate).

 

I am also mildly versed in the use of the web debugger/sniffer known as Fiddler so I suppose I could try to extract 'how TJ sorts dragons'.

 

However, there is also this little tidbit in the TOS to contend with:

Reverse Engineering

 

Users of the site agree not to reverse engineer or otherwise attempt to derive any processes or formulas used by the site's internal calculations.

 

I suppose people can try to derive the code if they want to be banned. I won't try to derive the code, but if you want to you can be my guest smile.gif And later tell me if you get banned.

 

PS. Pls - stop discussing of user interface - think of mechanics!

Erm. GUI. Means that we're not playing the game via commandline. I mean, I suppose you could play the game altogether without the user interface if you were a hacker or a cheater but for us normal users we really can't.

And I'd love to be able to play a game without the actual dragon artwork... but sadly it doesn't function well on a sprite/artwork based website...

 

slightly off-topic: I am not completely ignorant of coding/making or maintaining webservers but neither am I totally knowledgeable. I've used Dream Weaver in the past and I intend to set up an Apache server eventually; either on my iPod (light, I assure you) or one of my unused computers. Because of the various types of hacking including DDOS (or the infamous LOIC) or the infamous SQL injections or the various other security flaws that I really don't feel like pen testing or having my computer invaded by randoms on the internet, I have never really felt like hosting a website unless someone starts viewbombing my eggs and I suddenly feel the intense urge to include a web beacon in my signature.

Edited by DarkEternity

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I sort my dragons manually into a 'rainbow' of sorts. I've never liked the 'rainbow sort' option that we have, it sorts them quite oddly and my OCD can't handle it. I would much prefer if it sorted by 'dominant color' instead of 'color average'. I also prefer to keep breeds together when possible, i.e. splits.

 

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But what all of you would do if TJ said something like that? Like "I don't care, It works somehow...".

I'd say "fair enough, it's your game; thanks for keeping it free."

 

And if I decided I didn't want to play any more because it didn't play the way I wanted - I'd leave. Which is NOT going to happen !

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I put other because I sort for many different reasons, however I found this very time-consuming in the past, so now I don't really sort, but use names and documents to keep track of my dragons. I would take full advantage of any faster way of sorting and sort to keep my scroll looking nice and so that I could find the dragons I want to breed for lineages.

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