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ANSWERED:Raffle Rethink?

Should we increase the number of raffle Prizes given out?  

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I really, really doubt that someone who enjoys the game and would normally stay would decide to quit solely because they couldn't participate in a single raffle.

 

Like I said, I don't think there's much difference between being two weeks late for a Holiday release and being two weeks too new a player for a raffle. In both cases, you'll have another chance; sure, that chance might not be as nice as the first opportunity (CBs are worth more than lineaged Holidays usually, and having two shots at a raffle is better than one shot), but it's still a chance.

 

I don't think that having things that depend on time (and again, we're talking like a few months or just 50 dragons, here!) are all that stagnated or horrible or mean to newcomers.

I was referring to gameplay in general which hasn't had very much added to it in the many years I (and you) have been here. You can't deny that the game has been showing its age for some time, or that people are very loudly opposed to making any kind of change or optional content, which makes me all kinds of sad because I can only spend so much time here in a week when the only upkeep is throwing everything into fansites and refilling slots that have hatched.

 

The game isn't engaging, which is what makes the game become quite boring after a number of years. Years spent doing the same thing over and over and over.

 

Which is my point before the hilarious shouting started. Older players quit all the time. We can both probably name a few who were avid forumgoers who have left us. Older players can still quit and "waste" prize dragons after winning, even if it's received the very day before they go.

 

But if a newbie joins two weeks before an event, gets hyped up, shows up and participates only to be told that they aren't included in the prize draw? That's very mean. What did they do all that work for?

Edited by Lythiaren

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Hmmm.... one joins AFTER an event, the other joins BEFORE an event....

Yes, it would be unfair.

 

I can't see anything about that comparison that gives grounds for 'fairness'

Both are time-based. You join two weeks after a Holiday event, ah, drat, better luck next time. You're too new a member to participate in an event then ah, drat, better luck next time. Both are just a matter of joining at slightly the wrong time. It's not particularly unfair, just a bit annoying.

 

Of course, I'm still going off of my belief that trying to limit how many prizes go to people who are more likely to rapidly quit than others (aka people who join two weeks before a raffle) is a good thing. You disagree with that, so we're already arguing from two very different sides in which none of my ideas will likely look fair to you, ahaha.

 

Which is my point before the hilarious shouting started. Older players quit all the time. We can both probably name a few who were avid forumgoers who have left us. Older players can still quit and "waste" prize dragons after winning, even if it's the very day before they go.

 

And I understand that, Lyth. I know older players can and will quit, too. But the point I'm trying to make is that newer players are still much more likely to quit. The only way to fully prevent prize dragons from going to people who quit is to suggest some crazy thing where they shuffle to new scrolls when the owner is gone for ages or something. I don't support that at all. I just support upping the odds of it going to someone who won't immediately quit. ;____;

Edited by angelicdragonpuppy

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Both are time-based. You join two weeks after a Holiday event, ah, drat, better luck next time. You're too new a member to participate in an event then ah, drat, better luck next time. Both are just a matter of joining at slightly the wrong time. It's not particularly unfair, just a bit annoying.

 

Of course, I'm still going off of my belief that trying to limit how many prizes go to people who are more likely to rapidly quit than others (aka people who join two weeks before a raffle) is a good thing. You disagree with that, so we're already arguing from two very different sides in which none of my ideas will likely look fair to you, ahaha.

I joined about 3 weeks after the prizes were handed out for 2011, I was pretty pissed but I dealt with it and look now, silver trophy and I got the max amount of raffle tickets a user can get this year.

I think its fair biggrin.gif

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And I understand that, Lyth. I know older players can and will quit, too. But the point I'm trying to make is that newer players are still much more likely to quit. The only way to fully prevent prize dragons from going to people who quit is to suggest some crazy thing where they shuffle to new scrolls when the owner is gone for ages or something. I don't support that at all. I just support upping the odds of it going to someone who won't immediately quit. ;____;

So if you understand that older users may quit with a virgin prize on their scroll, why the apparent assumption that all/most/many newbies who win them will probably quit? It's their dragon. It's also their scroll. If they have a shiny and it's not enough to make them stick around, why is it so acceptable to tell everyone who's new that "people like that guy over there who might quit" or "that girl over there who got one and never shares and might as well not be here because she doesn't do anything" ruined their chances at winning anything in this very first event they participated in? Just because they were late. Really?

 

In other words, why do people have to earn the right to have one?

 

Like I said earlier, this isn't a job application. I don't have to show my credentials. This is a Christmas raffle and we've all got our tickets already. You can't tell a 20-year old that his lottery ticket isn't valid just because it's his first one and the little old lady behind him has been playing devotedly for forty years.

Edited by Lythiaren

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I don't support most of the purposed changes; I liked the way this year was set up.

 

As for users not breeding their prizes because they quit or just don't want to or for any other reason, that's their choice and it will always happen no matter what. It really sucks when this happens, but we shouldn't encourage new rules that will put new users or somewhat inactive users at a disadvantage in the raffles just because last year's raffle winners decided to hold out on us.

 

Out of the few posts I've read, the only idea I somewhat support is having completely brand new users wait until the next raffle.

Edited by Windnose

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I can't seem to see how the raffle is anything but fair. The fact that people quit after winning has nothing to do with anything else; they can quit if they want and they have no obligation towards dc outside of their personal interest. Just because you plan to do this and that, doesn't necessarily mean someone else plays the same. The raffle is random, and I don't see why you wouldn't prefer that compared to, say, another judging contest.

 

But the point I'm trying to make is that newer players are still much more likely to quit.

 

What. This doesn't make any sense. How so? How did you come to that point? Is it not true that every single one of us all started out as a newer player at one point? So what determined that *I* stayed, or *they* quit, or why *you* are still here? How do you know that the person who had joined yesterday will quit in a matter of hours, or will become the next dedicated user who stays with us til the end? You don't, because its a matter of everyone being different, not because they are new. Old players have as much chance quitting as a new player does.

 

I am an old player, and have been here and active since Feb 1st, 2009. However, I do not feel like I should be more inclined to win a prize compared to someone who just started.

 

So no, I am 200% against this suggestion.

Edited by Xythus

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I happened to join in October 2010 and there was a raffle that year. Now I'm a gold trophy and have 1000+ dragons. It's all very subjective, but would your opinion change if a new player happened to attempt to create multiple accounts before a raffle just to obtain raffle tickets? I suspect that some individuals that I know on other forums did just this.

Edited by DarkEternity

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From reading the thread, someone did do that last year and got burned.

Edited by Lythiaren

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Spam removed. Edited by SockPuppet Strangler

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Spam removed. Edited by SockPuppet Strangler

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From reading the thread, someone did do that last year and got burned.

How does a Multi-scroller even get caught?

I can't think of any way except IP Tracking and been Snitched.

But no ones gonna look at everyones IP and every scroll :/

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In a surprising quarterly report by social game analysis firm Playnomics, it has been revealed that 85% of new social game players do not return after the first day. The numbers only get worse as time went on in the study, with even more players leaving after three days and 95% having left by the end of the study.
Source

I would assume that this is true for basically all games. *shrugs

But I'm not entirely sure if excluding new players altogether will increase the number of prizes on active scrolls.

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Reading here and there I find this topic quite weird, why should they deny newer players the chance to win a raffle? I mean I've been here for around six months and so what? that makes people that have been playing for ages superior than me? I've seen older scrolls abandoned to the point that they've lost their names...

Edited by SockPuppet Strangler

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thats a little selfish dontcha think? i know if i get one after my goals for the species are met (or maybe even before) ill be trading the offpspring =P

If I won I'd gift to people I RP with and well know on the forums, I'd PM them.

Eventually they'd tell others but It might take longer to have to breed for LOTS of people biggrin.gif

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How does a Multi-scroller even get caught?

I can't think of any way except IP Tracking and been Snitched.

But no ones gonna look at everyones IP and every scroll :/

I imagine TJ has the server check through IPs and compare them. Not as hard as you'd think.

 

One of the things I learned in first year was that hashmaps are very, very fast and work well with huge numbers of items. Check if an IP is already in the hashmap, and if not, add it in. If it is already in, don't add it but chuck it in another list of some kind to log the account ID you checked to get the IP.

 

Voila, list of potential multiscrollers. Further layers of investigation probably required to determine if it's actual multiscrolling or just a public computer or a family computer.

 

thats a little selfish dontcha think? i know if i get one after my goals for the species are met (or maybe even before) ill be trading the offpspring =P

So? Her dragon. She doesn't owe the babies to anybody.

Edited by Lythiaren

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I imagine TJ has the server check through IPs and compare them. Not as hard as you'd think.

 

One of the things I learned in first year was that hashmaps are very, very fast and work well with huge numbers of items. Check if an IP is already in the hashmap, and if not, add it in. If it is already in, don't add it but chuck it in another list of some kind to log the account ID you checked to get the IP.

 

Voila, list of potential multiscrollers. Further layers of investigation probably required to determine if it's actual multiscrolling or just a public computer or a family computer.

Yea, but its online. If I didnt have the age on my profile I could say im 20 and people would believe me.

VERY easy to lie online, I could just deny it and say my brother plays DC too xd.png

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What. This doesn't make any sense. How so? How did you come to that point? Is it not true that every single one of us all started out as a newer player at one point? So what determined that *I* stayed, or *they* quit, or why *you* are still here? How do you know that the person who had joined yesterday will quit in a matter of hours, or will become the next dedicated user who stays with us til the end? You don't, because its a matter of everyone being different, not because they are new. Old players have as much chance quitting as a new player does.

Actually, it does make sense.

 

There are far more new players each year than there are older players, I believe. Older players do leave, but so do many new players. Players get bored, or forget about the site, or whatever.

 

Since there are so many more new players than older players, it logically makes sense that a greater percentage of newer players leave the game than older players do.

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Yea, but its online. If I didnt have the age on my profile I could say im 20 and people would believe me.

VERY easy to lie online, I could just deny it and say my brother plays DC too XD

Indeed, but that's what additional layers of investigation are for. :P

 

Like seeing if the usernames are obvious garbage strings (eg. fhjkashdkash), or if they follow a labeling convention, or if their account behaviour is very similar, etc.

 

Actually, it does make sense.

 

There are far more new players each year than there are older players, I believe.  Older players do leave, but so do many new players.  Players get bored, or forget about the site, or whatever.

 

Since there are so many more new players than older players, it logically makes sense that a greater percentage of newer players leave the game than older players do.

But is that a valid reason to target all new players, just in case they're the ones who drop?

 

It makes sense that there are more newer players, and indeed it's a bad sign if there are fewer new players than there are existing ones. By that same coin, deliberately excluding or restricting too-new players from events (as in this thread) is counterintuitive to the constant need to grow the playerbase.

Edited by Lythiaren

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But is that a valid reason to target all new players, just in case they're the ones who drop?

Is it a valid reason to discriminate when gifting to a player, if that player has dead eggs on their scrolls, is relatively new, neglects and freezes? I see it on plenty of gifting threads.

Edited by DarkEternity

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Is it a valid reason to discriminate when gifting to a player if that player has dead eggs on their scrolls, is relatively new, neglects and freezes? I see it on plenty of gifting threads.

A player has a right to determine where their eggs go, and while those eggs are on their scroll they remain their eggs. Unless they're slated for an autodrop, as in the case of holidays.

 

A raffle prize is given by the site rather than a person with preferences, and I fail to see how we have any right to force it to determine preferences and tell it where to put things. I mean honestly if we could do that then all our rares would breed true every week, wouldn't they?

Edited by Lythiaren

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Is it a valid reason to discriminate when gifting to a player, if that player has dead eggs on their scrolls, is relatively new, neglects and freezes? I see it on plenty of gifting threads.

One is gameplay and coded in

The other is personal choice. Valid reason or not, it's their choice.

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Oh well, forgive all of us who found this site after you, witnesses of dinosaurs, discovered it and claimed the crown of this.

 

The difference with gifting to players that freeze or have dead eggs is that you as a the gifter might want certain conditions met, but for raffles if the site owner doesn't have any kind of trouble that the winner is a new player or not why is it then such a big headache for all of you?

 

I mean jeez, yes, you found dragcave first, congratulations on that part, but hey at least I was introduced here by a friend who had been playing for a while and guess what? She quit. So think about this: older players have the same chance of taking an hiatus as do new players, doesn't matter if it's intentional or because something happened to you, we all have the same chance of leaving the game either permanently or temporarily.

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Again. Newer players have a higher rate of leaving than older players.

In a surprising quarterly report by social game analysis firm Playnomics, it has been revealed that 85% of new social game players do not return after the first day. The numbers only get worse as time went on in the study, with even more players leaving after three days and 95% having left by the end of the study.
Source

 

Same rate of quitting? I would think not.

 

Here is the infographic from the research report.

user posted image

Edited by DarkEternity

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