ANSWERED:Breeding between scrolls

[angelicdragonpuppy]

I support this as lineages would be easier to continue, but who would get the egg ?

The current idea is that the chances of an egg being produced would be halved, but if it succeeded then both participants would get an egg.

 

If you check the first post there's a whole bit there about the who would get the egg mechanics that covers it in more detail.

Edited August 26, 2012 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Fuzzbucket]

I support this as lineages would be easier to continue, but who would get the egg ?

As has been said several times, there would be two eggs and you would get one each.

 

Still not keen.

[Pixxelation]

I have to say that I've never supported this suggestion. x3

 

However, if it did happen, here is what I'd want to see:

-Two eggs, both of the same kind would be created, one for each user

-Since two eggs are being created, the chance of a successful breeding is halved

-An option under account settings to receive requests or not, default being off

-Ability to disallow some dragons to not be chosen or ability to select which dragons could be chosen

 

It's late and I'm exhausted, but I think that was it. o3o

Everything this says.

[fuzzzzj]

I would love to see multi scroll breeding because it would help lineage projects so much as long as it is completly optional. If this works I would like it to be something along the lines of what is stated below:

 

1.There would be an option under the account settings on whether you could recive requests at all, default would be blocking the requests.

 

2. To ask another person if you could breed one of your dragons with one of their dragons it would go something like this:

 

User A wants to breed Dragon A with another dragon not on their scroll. User A finds User B's scroll and sees Dragon B which they would like to breed Dragon A with.

 

User A would click on Dragon B taking User A to Dragon B's page. On the page would be an action that would say something like this, "Breed [insert dragon's name/code here] with one of your dragons" This would take User A to a page where he would select Dragon A. This would send a request to User B.

 

User B would recive the request and do one of the the three things, accept it, decline it, or nothing at all.

 

If User B does nothing the trade would expire after x amount of days.

If User B declines the request the breeding would be canceled and User A would get a message that says something like "User B has declined Dragon A's and Dragon B's breeding."

 

However if User B accepts the request then three things could happen, the dragons refuse each other, they breed but no egg is produced, or they breed and two eggs are produced. If the dragons refuse nobody gets an egg and they could never breed again. If the dragons breed but don't produce an egg nobody gets an egg but the dragons could breed again.

 

But if the dragons DO make eggs (the dragons would have a reduced chance of doing so, even less than just breeding two dragons on the same scroll) then both users would have the chance to accept one egg. Both eggs would be the same type.

 

If either user accepts the egg and they are egg locked their egg goes to the abandoned page. If after x days either user does nothing their egg goes to the abandonded page. If either user declines their egg it goes to the abandoned page.

 

User A and User B accept the eggs (Users A and B are not egg locked) they get their eggs hooray! The multi scroll breeding is now over.

 

Keep in mind that if either user had chosen to block requests then this couldn't of happened. Say User A wanted to breed Dragon A with Dragon B nut USer B has blocked requests then there wouldn't be an action to select.

[Thuban]

I have to say that I've never supported this suggestion. x3

 

However, if it did happen, here is what I'd want to see:

-Two eggs, both of the same kind would be created, one for each user

-Since two eggs are being created, the chance of a successful breeding is halved

-An option under account settings to receive requests or not, default being off

-Ability to disallow some dragons to not be chosen or ability to select which dragons could be chosen

 

It's late and I'm exhausted, but I think that was it. o3o

 

So... If someone wanted to breed gold/holiday.. If an egg is bred, there would be two golds bred, not just one. NO.

 

I dont like this idea. I dont want this to happen. Breeding ratios are screwed up enough as it is. Even with breeding chances halved.. oh hey, twice as many chances if two users decide to pair up and just spam breed holiday rares... every successful breeding = 2 eggs with this suggestion which means those of us who are only breeding on our own scrolls have even less of a change to actually get something worthwhile out of our own personal breeding stock.

 

 

Optional or not, this affects everyone, and i dont want it affecting MY scroll. I have enough things working against my breeding. People could easily abuse this and make rares even harder to breed than they are

Edited August 27, 2012 by Thuban

[angelicdragonpuppy]

So... If someone wanted to breed gold/holiday.. If an egg is bred, there would be two golds bred, not just one. NO.

 

I dont like this idea. I dont want this to happen. Breeding ratios are screwed up enough as it is. Even with breeding chances halved.. oh hey, twice as many chances if two users decide to pair up and just spam breed holiday rares... every successful breeding = 2 eggs with this suggestion which means those of us who are only breeding on our own scrolls have even less of a change to actually get something worthwhile out of our own personal breeding stock.

 

 

Optional or not, this affects everyone, and i dont want it affecting MY scroll. I have enough things working against  my breeding. People could easily abuse this and make rares even harder to breed than they are

If the chances of an egg being produced are halved, then no more rares are being produced than if two people are doing seperate, normal percentage breedings, Thu. They'll just get two golds at once out of twenty breedings together instead of each one of them managing to get a gold solo out of ten breedings (or whatever the more accurate amount of breedings to get a gold is).

 

It should also be noted that the halved chance of success + double egg production is only one of two possible ways this would be worked. If you check out the topic's starting post, I covered another way it would work, where if both people opt in to try to recieve an egg from the breeding, there'll be a 50/50 chance of which scroll it goes to (issues like both people opting out or if one or the other is locked are discussed on the front page).

Edited August 27, 2012 by angelicdragonpuppy

[StormWizard212]

So... If someone wanted to breed gold/holiday.. If an egg is bred, there would be two golds bred, not just one. NO.

 

I dont like this idea. I dont want this to happen. Breeding ratios are screwed up enough as it is. Even with breeding chances halved.. oh hey, twice as many chances if two users decide to pair up and just spam breed holiday rares... every successful breeding = 2 eggs with this suggestion which means those of us who are only breeding on our own scrolls have even less of a change to actually get something worthwhile out of our own personal breeding stock.

 

 

Optional or not, this affects everyone, and i dont want it affecting MY scroll. I have enough things working against my breeding. People could easily abuse this and make rares even harder to breed than they are

Yes, this. I'd be worried that even if I decided to opt out of it, it'd affect me anyway and I'd more or less be forced to participate eventually. If that makes sense. Someone else made a very good point about this being like teleport. It's optional, yes, but you can't trade the old way anymore so you kind of have to participate in it. I don't want my gameplay to be changed. :/

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Yes, this. I'd be worried that even if I decided to opt out of it, it'd affect me anyway and I'd more or less be forced to participate eventually. If that makes sense. Someone else made a very good point about this being like teleport. It's optional, yes, but you can't trade the old way anymore so you kind of have to participate in it. I don't want my gameplay to be changed. :/

e___e No, guys, do the math. If you half the chances of a successful breeding to make two eggs then it will NOT touch the ratios at all. You would have a better chance of getting a metallic by breeding solo then you would from partnering up.

 

And again, halving the chances and doubling the eggs was only ONE suggested way this could work. Please read all of the first post (or, well, at least the top half before I start listing reasons I'd enjoy this, haha) before you condemn it.

[Thuban]

If the chances of an egg being produced are halved, then no more rares are being produced than if two people are doing seperate, normal percentage breedings, Thu. They'll just get two golds at once out of twenty breedings together instead of each one of them managing to get a gold solo out of ten breedings (or whatever the more accurate amount of breedings to get a gold is).

and out of 68 metal pairings ive bred near weekly, i get about one metal every 4 months. Suddenly throwing 2 golds, even with reduced chances of actually getting eggs DOES affect everyone.

 

lets see: I pair my 5 cb metals with 5 of your holidays, and am lucky enough to get eggs on one breeding.. theres now two more in rotation That /might/ have only been one originally. Now.. lets spread this out a bit more. I decide im going to breed all of my metals to Infinis' holidays, ignoring lineage only because i want metal eggs.

 

Infi has over 300 metals.. I have 68.

Infi has over 100 holiday dragons, not including pygmies and vamps. I have 25.

 

 

So lets pair my 68 metals to infis holidays right off the bat, plus 25 of their metals to my 25 pairings. Thats 93 attempts in one week of getting double eggs.. if anything is successful. Now lets add in Tin/metal pairings, adding in another 32 pairings out of infis metals... if theres an egg, both tin and metal are valued, even if they arent as pretty. The not so pretty eggs still count against ratios and still prevent other people who are playing on their own scrolls from a fair shot at an egg.

 

 

And yes: infi agreed to be my example here. It doesnt matter if chances are halved, we are still tempting fate by breeding pairings that will only produce rares. I didnt account for my frills (add another 4 attempts, plus whatever infi has on their end). Plus.. whatever is leftover of infis stock could then be bred to someone elses rares, holidays and frills. Landing them well over 400 shots at a rare, rather than say.. 200 if we are only limiting to holiday rare pairings on their own breeding.

Edited August 27, 2012 by Thuban

[angelicdragonpuppy]

and out of 68 metal pairings ive bred near weekly, i get about one metal every 4 months. Suddenly throwing 2 golds, even with reduced chances of actually getting eggs DOES affect everyone.

 

lets see: I pair my 5 cb metals with 4 of your holidays, and am lucky enough to get eggs on one breeding.. theres now two more in rotation That /might/ have only been one originally. Now.. lets spread this out a bit more. I decide im going to breed all of my metals to Infinis' holidays, ignoring lineage only because i want metal eggs.

 

Infi has over 300 metals.. I have 68.

Infi has over 100 holiday dragons, not including pygmies and vamps. I have 25.

 

 

So lets pair my 68 metals to infis holidays right off the bat, plus 25 of their metals to my 25 pairings. Thats 93 attempts in one week of getting double eggs.. if anything is successful. Now lets add in Tin/metal pairings, adding in another 32 pairings out of infis metals... if theres an egg, both tin and metal are valued, even if they arent as pretty. The not so pretty eggs still count against ratios and still prevent other people who are playing on their own scrolls from a fair shot at an egg.

 

 

And yes: infi agreed to be my example here. It doesnt matter if chances are halved, we are still tempting fate my breeding pairings that will only produce rares. I didnt account for my frills (add another 4 attempts, plus whatever infi has on their end).

I still don't see how your example would produce more rares than people would by breeding on their own.

 

I personally breed almost all of my rares to non-breeders (Frills, Holidays) and I also get barely anything in return for it. With ratios already so low, I would have to have a really, really good reason to want to breed with someone else's dragons (and thus half my chances) rather than sticking with my own. It would produce double eggs if it succeeded, but only one would actually be going to ME, so I'd have to want a metal of that lineage more than I wanted a metal period.

 

Thus, I doubt many people would favor it as a way to get metals, and thus even if halving + double eggs somehow hurt the ratios (which I still fail to see, even with your example), I doubt many would do it.

 

And again, my original idea doesn't work by producing double eggs.

[Thuban]

You are still forcing users as a whole to deal with your suggestion, even if they opt out. Im aware that holiday/rare pairings have the same chance at rare as rare/common does, BUT at least with holiday rare pairings you dont get fail eggs.

 

Also.. check my edit.

[5icky]

How about Rares cannot be bred through this process.(such as holidays, not metals)

[Nine]

Yes, this. I'd be worried that even if I decided to opt out of it, it'd affect me anyway and I'd more or less be forced to participate eventually. If that makes sense. Someone else made a very good point about this being like teleport. It's optional, yes, but you can't trade the old way anymore so you kind of have to participate in it. I don't want my gameplay to be changed. :/

I don't see how anyone would be forced to participate. This method would offer no increased chance to get rares, or successful breedings, or really any benefit to actual gameplay at all. Other than the enjoyment of breeding with other names, codes, and dragons to make some pretty lineages.

 

Actually I take back what I said. There would be a change to gameplay; more fun! =)

 

Plus, the old method of trading was said to be completely unintentional and even being described as an exploited bug. Teleport BSA was DC's first attempt to officially say "trading now exists".

 

Edit: I think people may just be scared of something new. Completely understandable, but also non-progressive.

Edited August 27, 2012 by Nine

[TroupeMaster]

I'm agreeing with Thuban and fuzz here, and saying that I'm not for it

This would make the giant PB EG projects that people are working on less special, could possibly promote multiscrolling, and the way that the OP has brought up wanting a mate for a specific dragon several times, makes me think that this is just to get a dragon to continue this lineage.

Edited August 27, 2012 by TroupeMaster

[angelicdragonpuppy]

I'm agreeing with Thuban and fuzz here, and saying that I'm not for it

This would make the giant PB EG projects that people are working on less special, could possibly promote multiscrolling, and the way that the OP has brought up wanting a mate for a specific dragon several times, makes me think that this is just to get a dragon to continue this lineage.

I find your suggestion that my whole reason to do this is just to help myself very rude. :/

 

I've found a mate that works just fine with him, if you care to know, but I still have numerous other reasons I'd like this. I've simply used him as an example multiple times because he is one of the few dragons on my scroll that this COULD be helpful for--in general it wouldn't be of much use to me, though, as I find even-gens tedious no matter how they're done.

 

If this was implemented, WOULD it help me with a few things? Yes--but I had a lot more reasons to suggest it then "hurrdurr need matez for mai dargons don't care about the cave in general hurrdurr."

 

As for your other suggestions--giant PB even gen projects are still going to require a ton of work to accomplish no matter how they're done. Look at this Summer. Breeding between scrolls or not, it would take literal YEARS to create a perfect mate for him. I fail to see how that isn't a lot of hard work and effort.

 

And as for "encouraging multiscrolling," so does everything else from limited Holidays to creating NDs. People are always going to have reasons to cheat--but the nice thing is that most cheaters get caught.

Edited August 27, 2012 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Thuban]

This isnt a fear of something new, this is something that could severely affect even the users who opt out. Getting to eggs seems to be the popular vote from the last page or so, and no matter how i look at it, its something that would affect people that choose to opt out.

 

I only brought up rare/rare breeding because I can imagine many many people doing it, just because right now, metals are kinda hard to come by, and i see plenty of newer players in the chat that do not have metals. They would trade for them, people would gift them. A metal is a metal, no matter how ugly the lineage. Cross scroll breeding totally opens the door for more attempts per scroll. There is also nothing to stop multis from pumping their collections even more than they already do.

 

 

Even with the halved chance at successful breeding, more attempts per scroll for breeding rares means chances will be more likely. Having more bred rares, means less chance of seeing them in the cave, since the cave does seem to adjust for that. It also means the chances of breeding for the users who are attempting to keep to their own scrolls will have less of a chance of breeding success, since most users probably dont have massive rare/rare pairings they could abuse.

 

Yes, im beating this idea to the ground, but its the most obvious exploit that would be abused with this.

[fuzzzzj]

So... If someone wanted to breed gold/holiday.. If an egg is bred, there would be two golds bred, not just one. NO.

 

I dont like this idea. I dont want this to happen. Breeding ratios are screwed up enough as it is. Even with breeding chances halved.. oh hey, twice as many chances if two users decide to pair up and just spam breed holiday rares... every successful breeding = 2 eggs with this suggestion which means those of us who are only breeding on our own scrolls have even less of a change to actually get something worthwhile out of our own personal breeding stock.

 

 

Optional or not, this affects everyone, and i dont want it affecting MY scroll. I have enough things working against my breeding. People could easily abuse this and make rares even harder to breed than they are

I'm a little confused on what the problem is on what you are speaking of. Do you mean that the dragons could reproduce rapidly? (Such as the two users create a total of eight dragons in three minutes.) I would think that the dragons would have a week cooldown.

 

Or was the problem that it would make the ratios even more out of wack? If you breed to golds together normally it takes a long time. It would take even longer. I think for some poeple it takes six months for a successful gold breeding, so it would a take a year or longer for a successful gold breeding for multi scroll breeding.

 

The reason why I prefer two eggs instead of 50/50 chance is because what if one user gets really lucky and gets all the eggs. User A would be happy but User B would be mad, espically if User A refuses to give the bred egg under any circumstance. This could easily create drama and fights to the point where a mod might step in. I can invision something like this:

 

A: Hey, I haven't been getting any of our bred eggs. Could you please give me one of the five eggs we bred and that you've recived?

B: Well your just very unlucky apparently and I'm not giving you any of my eggs.

A: Yeah guess so, but why not?

B: Well they're my eggs so too bad.

A: Oh come on PLEASE?

B: No! I'm gonna breed my dragon with you anymore so too bad!

A: WHAT?!

Then a possible fight breaks out and everyone is unhappy.

 

Anyways, I just want to know why it would affect the ratios and force other people to participate. All I ask is for a brief explanation.

 

 

[Obscure_Trash]

I think a lot of times we use 'ratio' wrong here on the forum. I think a lot of times when people wonder if something will affect ratios they are really wondering if it will affect them. Which is reasonable; I just wanted to point it out.

 

Halved chance of getting two eggs/rares through community breeding = regular chance of two users breeding and each getting an egg/rare = regular chance of one user breeding two pairs and getting two eggs/rares

 

It doesn't change ratios and the only way I see it really affecting users in a big way is if a ton more people suddenly start breeding because of community breeding. ^^;;

[Fuzzbucket]

I find your suggestion that my whole reason to do this is just to help myself very rude. :/

 

I've found a mate that works just fine with him, if you care to know, but I still have numerous other reasons I'd like this. I've simply used him as an example multiple times because he is one of the few dragons on my scroll that this COULD be helpful for--in general it wouldn't be of much use to me, though, as I find even-gens tedious no matter how they're done.

 

If this was implemented, WOULD it help me with a few things? Yes--but I had a lot more reasons to suggest it then "hurrdurr need matez for mai dargons don't care about the cave in general hurrdurr."

 

As for your other suggestions--giant PB even gen projects are still going to require a ton of work to accomplish no matter how they're done. Look at this Summer. Breeding between scrolls or not, it would take literal YEARS to create a perfect mate for him. I fail to see how that isn't a lot of hard work and effort.

 

And as for "encouraging multiscrolling," so does everything else from limited Holidays to creating NDs. People are always going to have reasons to cheat--but the nice thing is that most cheaters get caught.

ALL Seasonal lineages take years. That's part of the joy (not ) of seasonal lineages; all mine are stalled because if the way Springs just never happened this year Being able to breed with another scroll would not have altered that.

 

 

[kerrikins]

Idk, I kind of see the whole idea of 'two' eggs causing a problem, considering that clutches of eggs is still a pretty sensitive subject - some want them, some don't. I can think of various problems, like two people getting bored and deciding to breed their dragons together en masse to dump the eggs to the AP, for example.

 

I'm still not sure if I like the idea of this whole thing at all, tbh. Doesn't this favour people who are on the forums and know others, as opposed to those working alone on their own scrolls? A lot of people don't even come to the forums.

[Nine]

I'm still not sure if I like the idea of this whole thing at all, tbh. Doesn't this favour people who are on the forums and know others, as opposed to those working alone on their own scrolls? A lot of people don't even come to the forums.

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Currently, if a person wants offspring from another user's dragon, there is absolutely no way to contact or make a deal with the person unless they know them on the forum. DC has no way to make trade 'suggestions' and trade links are only visible to people who have been given the code (ala forums).

 

With breeding between scrolls, users who do not use the forum now have a way to interact and request eggs from other scrolls. Maybe they found the person's scroll by searching up names, codes, the parents from their own dragons, bred eggs from the AP, etc. Of course, if the user has allowed their scroll to be viewed and has cross-breeding enabled. Person finds a dragon they really would love to breed with their own and can send the request; no forum contact necessary. Actual ways of speaking and negotiating with users still has its advantages, but it's no longer an absolute necessity for trading. The one with the requested dragon could even have the option to not want an egg for themselves (if successful). I think that's pretty ace.

 

Though, I'm not the creator of this concept so this is just me speaking from my P.o.V on why it would benefit those not on the forums =)

 

The problem you mentioned above would not be an issue should this be implemented. Any bored person can go breed their entire scroll to the AP as it is, and it was suggested that multiscroll breeding would have 50% less chance of being successful. If a person really wants to flood the AP they will have the option to do so, with just as much success, regardless if this is implemented or not.

 

It sounds like a lot of people that are unsure of this idea are simply misunderstanding concepts. I strongly encourage extra-thorough reading so it's crystal clear how great (and optional) of a feature this would be in cave!

[kerrikins]

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Currently, if a person wants offspring from another user's dragon, there is absolutely no way to contact or make a deal with the person unless they know them on the forum. DC has no way to make trade 'suggestions' and trade links are only visible to people who have been given the code (ala forums).

 

With breeding between scrolls, users who do not use the forum now have a way to interact and request eggs from other scrolls. Maybe they found the person's scroll by searching up names, codes, the parents from their own dragons, bred eggs from the AP, etc. Of course, if the user has allowed their scroll to be viewed and has cross-breeding enabled. Person finds a dragon they really would love to breed with their own and can send the request; no forum contact necessary. Actual ways of speaking and negotiating with users still has its advantages, but it's no longer an absolute necessity for trading. The one with the requested dragon could even have the option to not want an egg for themselves (if successful). I think that's pretty ace.

 

 

It sounds like a lot of people that are unsure of this idea are simply misunderstanding concepts. I strongly encourage extra-thorough reading so it's crystal clear how great (and optional) of a feature this would be in cave!

I guess I hadn't really thought about the fact that someone might actually just message me out of nowhere about doing this - I'd strongly dislike it if someone I didn't know did that to me, which is a reason I'd probably have this feature turned off. I guess that's why it didn't occur to me that it might be easier for people not on the forum.

 

Idk. It seems overly complicated and I'm still not sure that it wouldn't lead to concentration of rares among those who already have them, because of the fact that the two people breeding could end up with one more each.

 

I read the idea carefully, I'm just not a big fan. It is actually possible.

[Nine]

Idk. It seems overly complicated and I'm still not sure that it wouldn't lead to concentration of rares among those who already have them, because of the fact that the two people breeding could end up with one more each.

There was a discussion a few posts up where it was concluded that this feature would not provide any more rares than is currently possible by breeding alone.

Halved chance of getting two eggs/rares through community breeding = regular chance of two users breeding and each getting an egg/rare = regular chance of one user breeding two pairs and getting two eggs/rares

So those with lots of rares would have the same chance they do currently to get more bred rares. Unless you meant something different?

[Pokemonfan13]

I guess I hadn't really thought about the fact that someone might actually just message me out of nowhere about doing this - I'd strongly dislike it if someone I didn't know did that to me, which is a reason I'd probably have this feature turned off. I guess that's why it didn't occur to me that it might be easier for people not on the forum.

 

Idk. It seems overly complicated and I'm still not sure that it wouldn't lead to concentration of rares among those who already have them, because of the fact that the two people breeding could end up with one more each.

 

I read the idea carefully, I'm just not a big fan. It is actually possible.

How is it any different than a random person PMing you and saying "I saw that you have a _____ on your scroll, would you please breed it for me?" ? You just say "no".

 

Ideally there should be a way to block requests from an individual, that way you could keep your scroll open to requests but stop those who are obnoxious about it from spamming your scroll with requests. =3

[fuzzzzj]

Ideally there should be a way to block requests from an individual, that way you could keep your scroll open to requests but stop those who are obnoxious about it from spamming your scroll with requests. =3

^

I agree with feature, you should be able to block individuals but keep your scroll open.