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Lord_Kishin

Gay Straight Alliance

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Yes, I can understand where you guys are coming from. ^^ I thought it was cool that my school did anything to recognize the community's rights, though. :3

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Even if DoS has its flaws I still wished my high school did it.

There was nothing for the LGBTA+ community there.

Then again it was a Catholic school so anything queer related was met with a ton of hate.

 

My school did have DoS for other things and I have noticed that it does spark discussion and the spread of information where it wouldn't have been before.

I think a presentation before DoS where people discuss LGBTA+ issues and share stories would help.

And of course protection for the people participating. If someone was trying to break someone's silence during a DoS they would be given a detention.

Edited by kitsune93

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Honestly, I do not understand why these people are hated. They are humans, right? Unless they are somehow not human, nobody deserves that

 

Then again, homaphobes have the same illogical reasoning colonists and slave owners had over Native Americans and slaves dry.gif

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-snip-

My school did have DoS for other things and I have noticed that it does spark discussion and the spread of information where it wouldn't have been before.

I think a presentation before DoS where people discuss LGBTA+ issues and share stories would help.

And of course protection for the people participating. If someone was trying to break someone's silence during a DoS they would be given a detention.

I really love this idea, wow. Do you mind if I do this next year? I think that'd be super neat.

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Honestly, I do not understand why these people are hated. They are humans, right? Unless they are somehow not human, nobody deserves that

 

Then again, homaphobes have the same illogical reasoning colonists and slave owners had over Native Americans and slaves dry.gif

It's religion that fuels a lot of it. At least that's their excuse.

 

Honestly there was a lot of support for LGBTA+ people in my school from teachers and faculty just not from the parents.

In my senior year the principal wanted the drama club to do a play about a hate crime on a gay man, I forget the name of the play.

There was such an outcry from the parents that the bishop had to shut down the play.

It was well supported in school but at the end of the day it's the homophobic parents who get the say.

 

So yeah, it's pretty ironic that leaders of the Church are for gay rights and support queer people but there are so many members of the Church that are against them.

 

I really love this idea, wow. Do you mind if I do this next year? I think that'd be super neat.

 

I don't mind at all.

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It's religion that fuels a lot of it. At least that's their excuse.

 

Honestly there was a lot of support for LGBTA+ people in my school from teachers and faculty just not from the parents.

In my senior year the principal wanted the drama club to do a play about a hate crime on a gay man, I forget the name of the play.

There was such an outcry from the parents that the bishop had to shut down the play.

It was well supported in school but at the end of the day it's the homophobic parents who get the say.

 

So yeah, it's pretty ironic that leaders of the Church are for gay rights and support queer people but there are so many members of the Church that are against them.

 

 

 

I don't mind at all.

Oh my god, just.....*sigh* Maybe I am lucky that Lutherans are flexible about this kind of stuff dry.gif

 

The homaphobes seem to often get the say in the end...

 

Honestly, I am glad that Rebecca Sugar took a leap of faith and made some happy space rock lesbians in Steven Universe. Since younger kids are watching, it hopefully helps to teach kids that- hey, it's okay, you can love who you want! So far, I have not heard much protest, but i might come...

 

 

And people have the gull to say humanity is going in the right directions...I swear, something silly like this will tear us apart from the inside...

 

*whacks my fantasy self with a large breadstick*

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Well, if you're in America or other countries with a strong religious influence, it makes sense that the religious homophobes get what they want. They're pretty fond of throwing others of their religion who are pro-queer rights under the bus as well. Every time a queer person asks to be treated like a human being, they scream that our existence is infringing on their "religious freedom". Apparently religious freedom is spewing hate speech at those undeserving of it.

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Well, if you're in America or other countries with a strong religious influence, it makes sense that the religious homophobes get what they want. They're pretty fond of throwing others of their religion who are pro-queer rights under the bus as well. Every time a queer person asks to be treated like a human being, they scream that our existence is infringing on their "religious freedom". Apparently religious freedom is spewing hate speech at those undeserving of it.

*sigh*

 

I dream of a day when everybody gets rights and religion is not an excuse. Some people are not of a religion, and normally we give THEM equal treatment. So why not give the queer community rights if they are of a different belief as well?

 

Humans. I wish I could ACTUALLY be a wolf right now

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Well, if you're in America or other countries with a strong religious influence, it makes sense that the religious homophobes get what they want. They're pretty fond of throwing others of their religion who are pro-queer rights under the bus as well. Every time a queer person asks to be treated like a human being, they scream that our existence is infringing on their "religious freedom". Apparently religious freedom is spewing hate speech at those undeserving of it.

Yes, but most of these religious people probably haven't read the whole Bible. Leviticus, that says that a man lying with a man is a sin, also forbids you to wear clothes of mixed fibers, to eat shellfish and pork, and, oh, don't forget that menstruating women should be kept apart from everybody else for a week.

Therefore, these people are hypocrites.

Edited by lightbird

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Yes, but most of these religious people probably haven't read the whole Bible. Leviticus, that says that a man lying with a man is a sin, also forbids you to wear clothes of mixed fibers, to eat shellfish and pork, and, oh, don't forget that menstruating women should be kept apart from everybody else for a week.

Therefore, these people are hypocrites.

Yeah, makes sense

 

So, they're pretty much going OPPOSITE of the Bible amd going with the Devil instead.

 

Makes sense. After all, these people have a place in the world and shoving them out just because of who they have eyes for is just plain wrong

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Yes, but most of these religious people probably haven't read the whole Bible. Leviticus, that says that a man lying with a man is a sin, also forbids you to wear clothes of mixed fibers, to eat shellfish and pork, and, oh, don't forget that menstruating women should be kept apart from everybody else for a week.

Therefore, these people are hypocrites.

Also, the people who quote Leviticus against homosexuality have no idea what the passage is actually for. Levititcus was a priest's manual and not intended for the regular worshippers.

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Also, the people who quote Leviticus against homosexuality have no idea what the passage is actually for. Levititcus was a priest's manual and not intended for the regular worshippers.

Yep. Unfortunately most Abrahamic religions don't care as long as they get some out-of-context passage that lets them hate as much as they want. :/

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Wow.

 

Excuses excuses, they make me sick. Sadly, I think the argument will never end. Homaphobes are homaphobes, they think that love is defined by who you can have babies with, and not by who you want to stay with for the rest of your life dry.gif

 

Biology is one thing, emotions are another. They are not the same thing AT ALL

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A lot of argument against LGBTQ+ people centers around the ability to have children, which is so far from legitimate it's not even in the same ballpark. It ignores and others heterosexual couples who can't have kids for biological reasons, or emotional reasons.

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Wow.

 

Excuses excuses, they make me sick. Sadly, I think the argument will never end. Homaphobes are homaphobes, they think that love is defined by who you can have babies with, and not by who you want to stay with for the rest of your life dry.gif

 

Biology is one thing, emotions are another. They are not the same thing AT ALL

Just wanted to point out that the biological argument against homosexuality is seriously flawed, not only because a relationship shouldn't be defined by the ability to reproduce or not, but because homosexuality is not solely observed in humans! There is the argument that "technically speaking, an organism's sole purpose in life is to reproduce" and then there is the argument that us humans are more advanced and we have, in a way, transcended that primal biological purpose, whereas animals still just have the need to reproduce, but in fact homosexual behavior has been observed in many species. So obviously the need to find someone of the opposite sex and reproduce doesn't trump all feelings. And then of course we get into the argument of whether there are "opposite sexes" anyway when nowadays the focus is on gender identity, not sex in terms of genitalia, which cannot be classified as a strict female/male binary anyway because there are intersex people in the world!

 

TL;DR - biology is a poor argument against homosexuality because 1) making babies is not our Grand Purpose, 2) humans are not the only animals engaging in homosexual behavior so clearly that supports the fact that reproduction isn't the #1 purpose of all life, and 3) the biological argument relies on a sex/gender binary that frankly doesn't exist.

 

Forgive me if my thoughts seem scattered (and at times unclear or contradictory) - I have trouble articulating my thoughts sometimes =P

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A lot of argument against LGBTQ+ people centers around the ability to have children, which is so far from legitimate it's not even in the same ballpark. It ignores and others heterosexual couples who can't have kids for biological reasons, or emotional reasons.

It also ignores and erases queer people in a relationship who can produce children.

 

Not to mention having children isn't the end all be all of a relationship or the goal of life. =p

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TL;DR - biology is a poor argument against homosexuality because 1) making babies is not our Grand Purpose, 2) humans are not the only animals engaging in homosexual behavior so clearly that supports the fact that reproduction isn't the #1 purpose of all life, and 3) the biological argument relies on a sex/gender binary that frankly doesn't exist.

As an asexual I can confirm that babies aren't what make the world go round.

 

If people want to bring biology into this then they should also consider that we have 7 billion people on this planet. The glorification of having children does not help this massively destructive phenomenon in any respect whatsoever.

 

My personal policies:

 

1. Stop freaking out about what other people do in bed, because it's none of your business. You're not the sex referee.

 

2. People will pursue what makes them happy and should not be interfered permitted that what they are doing isn't destructive to other human beings. LGBTQ sexual activity is not "destructive" to humanity, and don't even try to argue that it is. Its outcome is no different than that of heterosexual activity with the exception of a 0% baby outcome with homosexual relations.

 

3. We don't cater to what any particular 3000+ year old religious book says word-by-word. Let's get real here; plenty of people eat shellfish. We also don't sell sexually harassed women to their assailants.

 

4. If you don't like the concept of a gay marriage, then don't go to one. Frankly if you want to try and stop gay marriage then the hosts probably don't want you attending anyway.

 

5. Britney Spears had a 55 hour long marriage, and Kim Kardashian had a 3 month long marriage. THAT is a debasing the value of marriage. Gay marriage isn't an abomination altogether, especially when you discover that quite a few of them last 10+ years.

 

6. Having two parents of the same sex is far better than having no parents at all.

 

7. LGBTQ media doesn't turn people gay; the millions upon millions of straight media hasn't done a good job of keeping everyone straight, has it? Media doesn't determine sexuality.

 

 

Aaaaand that's my two cents. *waves ace flag*

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7. LGBTQ media doesn't turn people gay; the millions upon millions of straight media hasn't done a good job of keeping everyone straight, has it? Media doesn't determine sexuality.

A hundred rounds of applause to basically everything you said, but I really like this bit because I personally don't see it discussed very often. LGBTQ media influences sexuality only by helping people realize that they are not straight. It doesn't turn anyone, but rather helps them come to terms with feelings they may not have addressed. In fact, in middle school, I read the Pretty Little Liars series and the relationship between Maya and Emily helped me realize that my "friend crush" on a girl was actually a legitimate crush & that I was not straight. As for straight media, if anything it only helped me in discovering that I wasn't straight. The overt sexualization of females by straight media, though controversial, definitely helped me recognize & understand my attraction to them.

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As an asexual I can confirm that babies aren't what make the world go round.

 

If people want to bring biology into this then they should also consider that we have 7 billion people on this planet. The glorification of having children does not help this massively destructive phenomenon in any respect whatsoever.

 

My personal policies:

 

1. Stop freaking out about what other people do in bed, because it's none of your business. You're not the sex referee.

 

2. People will pursue what makes them happy and should not be interfered permitted that what they are doing isn't destructive to other human beings. LGBTQ sexual activity is not "destructive" to humanity, and don't even try to argue that it is. Its outcome is no different than that of heterosexual activity with the exception of a 0% baby outcome with homosexual relations.

 

3. We don't cater to what any particular 3000+ year old religious book says word-by-word. Let's get real here; plenty of people eat shellfish. We also don't sell sexually harassed women to their assailants.

 

4. If you don't like the concept of a gay marriage, then don't go to one. Frankly if you want to try and stop gay marriage then the hosts probably don't want you attending anyway.

 

5. Britney Spears had a 55 hour long marriage, and Kim Kardashian had a 3 month long marriage. THAT is a debasing the value of marriage. Gay marriage isn't an abomination altogether, especially when you discover that quite a few of them last 10+ years.

 

6. Having two parents of the same sex is far better than having no parents at all.

 

7. LGBTQ media doesn't turn people gay; the millions upon millions of straight media hasn't done a good job of keeping everyone straight, has it? Media doesn't determine sexuality.

 

 

Aaaaand that's my two cents. *waves ace flag*

Yeees, praise you, for all of that!

 

Also to add for religion

 

God created us all as his children, correct? Well, if he hated gays, why would he create them?

 

Think about that

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Yeees, praise you, for all of that!

 

Also to add for religion

 

God created us all as his children, correct? Well, if he hated gays, why would he create them?

 

Think about that

Ah yes the greatest paradox. The signs along the road tell me that Jesus and God love me, but their most devoted followers tell me I am condemned! rolleyes.gif

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My personal favorite response when faced with the transphobic argument, "God doesn't make mistakes!", is... well, exactly. He made me trans so people like you can learn acceptance. He wanted me to have this extra challenge in my life. We're here to learn, according to the Bible, so... who exactly is learning when everyone is too narrow-minded to accept other people? I'm not trans because of a mistake, I'm just trans. Anyone who says differently can stick it. I kind of believe in god? Sort of? EEH Religion is hard.

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Also to add for religion

There is also the fact that many different religions exist, and some are accepting of LGBTQA people. By pushing religious reasons for fighting against gay rights is also pushing your religion on people who possibly don't practice it, in which case your religious beliefs should not have any relevance to their daily lives unless they practice the same religion as you. Of course in some countries, provinces, states and cities this s harder to do than others because religion and law are so interconnected, which the shouldn't be.

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There is also the fact that many different religions exist, and some are accepting of LGBTQA people. By pushing religious reasons for fighting against gay rights is also pushing your religion on people who possibly don't practice it, in which case your religious beliefs should not have any relevance to their daily lives unless they practice the same religion as you. Of course in some countries, provinces, states and cities this s harder to do than others because religion and law are so interconnected, which the shouldn't be.

Sit down, children, it's storytime! *gets out puppets*

 

Once upon a time I was in high school in South Carolina, which is the epitome of the Bible Belt. The kids in my high school had to take three science classes, per the requirements of a high school education. You could either go the chemistry route or the biology route. Now here's the kicker: the basic biology class also doubled as the sex ed class, as roughly two weeks were taken from the regularly scheduled curriculum to teach kids about wee-wees.

 

Here's Issue #1: the sex ed class was intertwined with the basic biology class. This means the kids who decided on chemistry (a.k.a. about half the school) never had to take sex ed.

 

Issue #2: It was technically not an abstinence-based course, as the teacher explained the different forms of contraceptives, but she never explained to us how to get a hold of these contraceptives or the process of how to use them. We never learned how to put on a condom; we only saw pictures of condoms and were given a verbal description of how they work. Same went for contraceptives such as the pill and the sponge.

 

Issue #3: The sex ed class only went over vaginal sex. There was no discussion whatsoever on oral or anal sex.

 

Issue #4: Sex between non-straight couples wasn't mentioned. Ever. Not even once. The class was centered entirely on heterosexual relations.

 

 

Now I'm not pointing fingers, but I'm a little suspicious of a religious influence here, especially considering the South Carolina population is 93% the Christian denomination. So I confirm your statement that it is rather hard to govern keeping the separation of church and state in certain areas.

 

I also don't like the fact that I can't put a pro-LGBTQ rights sticker on my car without running the high risk that my car will get key scratched. Just putting that out there. I love my Scion too much to take that risk.

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The sex ed is the same here in Colorado. I think part of it is that everyone is uncomfortable and they just want it to be over with, but it's still pretty definitively heteronormative...

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I wouldn't say sex ed is perfect here in B.C., but in grade 6-7 we had a little unit (like a few days in the year) that was used for teaching us about puberty. Sex was mentioned, but obviously not the focus.

 

In Grade 9 there is a unit in the Science 9 (which is mandatory) curriculum based on reproduction and it does go into human reproduction and we learned about the development of the fetus and what happens in the different trimesters. In P.E. 9 (Which is also a mandatory course) there was the Health unit. How my high school handled the health units was that the class would be designated a month where they go to a classroom to leaner the uni there. Grade 8 was on Drugs and Substance Abuse, Grade 9 was Sexual Education and Grade 10 was on Nutrition.

 

In Health 9 the main focus was on STDs/STIs. We did learn about sex, but mostly vaginal sex was discussed, although other forms of sex were at least mentioned briefly but not discussed in depth (A bunch of us thought oral sex meant talking about sex before the teachers started staying that it could pass on STIs as well). A large portion of the unit did talk about contraceptives and birth control though. At the end we had a project to do based on researching a specified STI and we would have a walk around to see the posters from the other groups, again showing that the course was primarily based on STIs, but at least mentioned other things. Some classes did learn about how t use a condom, but I don't think my teacher talked about that, so either she forgot or maybe we ended up pressed for time so she didn't mention it?

 

Over all i would say it was heteronormative though. Although other forms of sex were mentioned, none of it was in the context of a non-het relationship, it was more of a side note saying "These exist too!"

Edited by psyshock

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