Death Penalty

[Silverwingwyvren]

WHat are your view on this subject is it right or wrong?

[choco566]

I find it downright immoral. Sure, that person supposedly killed someone else, but does two wrongs make a right? No.

 

I don't understand how we allow this. Someone could be a complete heartless killer and yet it doesn't give anyone a right to kill them, does it? Lockdown for life seems like a better fit punishment. Let them drown in boredom instead. It's less violent and probably has more morality. I believe in nonviolent punishment and life over death morality, so that's why I dislike the "death penalty" with such despision. I guess it's safe to say that it's one of the few things I hate. And believe me, I don't hate much. :/

Edited December 1, 2011 by choco566

[Kestra15]

Not a fan of it.

[Silverwingwyvren]

I find it downright immoral. Sure, that person supposedly killed someone else, but does two wrongs make a right? No.

 

I don't understand how we allow this. Someone could be a complete heartless killer and yet it doesn't give anyone a right to kill them, does it? Lockdown for life seems like a better fit punishment. Let them drown in boredom instead. It's less violent and probably has more morality. I believe in nonviolent punishment and life over death morality, so that's why I dislike the "death penalty" with such despision. I guess it's safe to say that it's one of the few things I hate. And believe me, I don't hate much. :/

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! Yes finally some one understands what I try and tell people!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Dude, its so dumb did you know the black guy they falsely exicuted in Atlanta was a Jehovah's Witness!!!!! How many Jehovah's Witnesses do you know that kill people??!??!?!!?!?

[The Evil Doer]

Fully support it !!!!!

 

Would make it a more speedy process, would like to have it in every state (and everywhere across the globe), and would make it an automatic punishment for certain crimes

[Kestra15]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! Yes finally some one understands what I try and tell people!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Dude, its so dumb did you know the black guy they falsely exicuted in Atlanta was a Jehovah's Witness!!!!! How many Jehovah's Witnesses do you know that kill people??!??!?!!?!?

http://www.exjehovahswitness.net/2009/08/j...ct-on-insurance

[Sir Barton]

I'm all for it but like Evil Doer I wish is was fast tracked so it wasn't so costly. Yep, there is bound to be some collateral damage with some innocent folks killed but over all it should make society safer. Right now it doesn't work because criminals know that they have years to appeal and with the right lawyer they may finally get off. Limit the appeals and people might just start thinking twice about committing that violent crime.

 

We put down rapid dogs; why should this be any different?

Edited December 2, 2011 by Sir Barton

[AlternateMew]

Pros/Cons I see:

 

Pros:

- In my opinion, it's more humane to kill them. Think about it: when there's a dangerous animal loose, what's the better option? Lock them away for the rest of their miserable lives while using resources that others could benefit from, or put them down, out of their misery and out of everyone else's?

- Resources. It's costly to keep someone alive. And you know they're locked up for life. If they're mierable, put them down.

- I support Kira. /shot by everyone who gets the reference.

 

Cons:

- The executor is no better than the criminal. The only difference is that it's legal murder.

- Every being has a right to life. To take that away, is wrong. Even if it does happen to thousands daily.

 

EDIT: Yeah, also what Sir Barton said.

Edited December 2, 2011 by AlternateMew

[Silverwingwyvren]

Dude Jehovah's witnesses don't build churchs, that is an apostate site man, false information, it happens a lot.

 

WHat about the people who have to kill them, they're are inturn no matter what legal serial killers. And you can't say they because they're killing people and half the time they're killing some one who was falsely accusted and died wrong fully. And killing the person makes the family of the person on death row suffer just because some one else wanted them dead.

[Kestra15]

Dude Jehovah's witnesses don't build churchs, that is an apostate site man, false information, it happens a lot.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10...ld-sinners.html

 

Just another example.

Edited December 2, 2011 by Kestra15

[The Evil Doer]

Dude Jehovah's witnesses don't build churchs, that is an apostate site man, false information, it happens a lot.

 

WHat about the people who have to kill them, they're are inturn no matter what legal serial killers. And you can't say they because they're killing people and half the time they're killing some one who was falsely accusted and died wrong fully. And killing the person makes the family of the person on death row suffer just because some one else wanted them dead.

Half of the time ? You are seriosuly wrong.

Those who execute are doing so by choice, also there is an option of not knowing who is pulling the right plug.

The family of the man/woman executed is suffering only because of his/her choices/actions, sorry, but the family of the victim gets more empathy from me than the family of the criminal.

Edited December 2, 2011 by The Evil Doer

[Sir Barton]

The system killing them isn't what causes their family to suffer. The action that got that individual on death row in the first place is what causes their family to suffer. They themselves bring suffer on their own family. I also really don't think it's the wrong guy half the time. I am willing to believe that number is much lower just because of our due process.

[WereJace]

Not a fan. There have been too many innocent persons executed for the idea to sit well with me. Keep them alive, institutionalize them, study them so we can figure out how to keep them from happening again.

[Kelkelen]

I think Silverwingwyvren's point about the family is a good one. Having a loved one executed has a much worse impact on the innocent relatives than just knowing that person is locked up for life. I don't see a good enough reason to cause *them* that suffering.

 

Also, I can never concur with a "collateral damage" mindset. We need to value individual lives, and strive for equality and justice for all -- the goal should be to *never* execute an innocent. Right now, it happens with alarming frequency. At least if a wrongly-convicted person is still alive, there's still a chance of them regaining their freedom.

 

Executions are expensive as well. There's a maintenance cost for prisoners, but the proportion of death row prisoners is so low as not to make a real difference in terms of food, clothing, and care, while the price for something like lethal injection is relatively high.

 

Capital punishment doesn't act as a deterrent for crime, which is one idea often used to support it. Even publicly airing the executions has made no difference in the criminal community.

 

I think the bottom line is that we use capital punishment for revenge, not justice. And it does mean that we have "legal murder." I don't think it makes sense. If we, as a society, profess that taking the life of another person willfully is wrong, then I don't think we have any grounds to do it as punishment. So long as prison is an option, I think we should use it instead.

[~Kat~]

I do believe in the death penalty for murderers. Before they are put to death, you dern well better have DNA to prove it though. No excuse for an innocent man to die PERIOD.

 

When you commit a murder, you made that choice. What about the victims family and the person they killed.

 

I am sick of the bleeding hearts for these moronic drivals who need to be elimentated before they can do harm to someone else. Think if it was you or a family member they killed.

 

A lot of your money and my money would stay in your pockets if they were put to death instead of supporting them, where they have all the comforts they want. The system is a joke though.

[AlternateMew]

Dude Jehovah's witnesses don't build churchs, that is an apostate site man, false information, it happens a lot.

 

WHat about the people who have to kill them, they're are inturn no matter what legal serial killers. And you can't say they because they're killing people and half the time they're killing some one who was falsely accusted and died wrong fully. And killing the person makes the family of the person on death row suffer just because some one else wanted them dead.

Unfortunate. It is sad that there are misblamed people, and those who kill in legit self-defense should not be charged in the first place. These are truly sad cases. And as for the families? Also sad. I can't disagree with that.

 

Small story from me - When I was 2, I was attacked by a dog. This dog was a Siberian Husky, and in all honesty, she was just playing. She didn't know she was hurting me. I was hospitalized, and got over 100 stitches because of this, and the dog was put down due to being "violent".

 

Now that I'm old enough to understand, this makes me sad. I feel the dog was misblamed, and not given a proper chance. I do not hate her. Was that really fair?

 

... I started tearing up typing that. Bad memory. Anyway, point is, it's going to happen. Does Utopia Justify The Means? Tough question. While it's hard to say it, personally, I support the penalty. I support it as a necessary evil, not as the only/best solution.

[Silverwingwyvren]

The person getting executed has to have their family watch on the other side of the glass, dude thats sick! So the other family of the killer doesn't matter, heck they don't exist apparently, the killer has no family.

 

Thats someone's dad or mom or brother or granfather they have to sit and watch them die thats pretty cruel. See half the time the victims family doesn't see their loved one killed most do but to have a pregnant woman watch her husband die in front wtf is she gonna tell the kid, "Oh your dad was executed...." WTF!!!!!! what is that!?

 

Mostly a few southern states still have a racist thing going.

 

Dude I'm Jehovah's Witness and I know for sure and can tell the difference man nothing like what you showed me can ever change my mind, Have you heard of the extreme opposition witnesses recieve in other countries? A woman in the country of goeriga had her unborn child killed when presits from a church raided the kingdom hall how sick is that?!

Edited December 2, 2011 by Silverwingwyvren

[The Evil Doer]

 

 

 

I think Silverwingwyvren's point about the family is a good one.  Having a loved one executed has a much worse impact on the innocent relatives than just knowing that person is locked up for life.  I don't see a good enough reason to cause *them* that suffering.

 

How so ? Dead is worse than alive and still taunting you ? Having a constant reminder of something horrific or trying to put it behind you ?

What about the victim's family ? should we allow the killer to mail them and keep messing with them, to maybe train others to kill as he did ? What about their peace of mind ?

 

Also, I can never concur with a "collateral damage" mindset.  We need to value individual lives, and strive for equality and justice for all -- the goal should be to *never* execute an innocent.  Right now, it happens with alarming frequency.  At least if a wrongly-convicted person is still alive, there's still a chance of them regaining their freedom. 

 

Yeah, I would also like to live in a world where there is no crime, starvation or diseases, where its all peachy however thats not the reality of things so "collateral damage" is a reality, we dont like it, but we accept it..

 

Executions are expensive as well.  There's a maintenance cost for prisoners, but the proportion of death row prisoners is so low as not to make a real difference in terms of food, clothing, and care, while the price for something like lethal injection is relatively high.

 

Thats why it should be a speedy process, no appeals, just take him out, like they did back in the days, saves the drama

 

Capital punishment doesn't act as a deterrent for crime, which is one idea often used to support it.  Even publicly airing the executions has made no difference in the criminal community. 

 

Ohh, really ? You dont think thats because it takes ages to execute someone ?

In some countries where its done swiftly, crime rates went down rapidly.

 

I think the bottom line is that we use capital punishment for revenge, not justice.  And it does mean that we have "legal murder."  I don't think it makes sense.  If we, as a society, profess that taking the life of another person willfully is wrong, then I don't think we have any grounds to do it as punishment.  So long as prison is an option, I think we should use it instead.

 

Revenge ? Isnt revenge usually a personal act ?

[Sir Barton]

I think Silverwingwyvren's point about the family is a good one. Having a loved one executed has a much worse impact on the innocent relatives than just knowing that person is locked up for life. I don't see a good enough reason to cause *them* that suffering.

 

Also, I can never concur with a "collateral damage" mindset. We need to value individual lives, and strive for equality and justice for all -- the goal should be to *never* execute an innocent. Right now, it happens with alarming frequency. At least if a wrongly-convicted person is still alive, there's still a chance of them regaining their freedom.

 

Executions are expensive as well. There's a maintenance cost for prisoners, but the proportion of death row prisoners is so low as not to make a real difference in terms of food, clothing, and care, while the price for something like lethal injection is relatively high.

 

Capital punishment doesn't act as a deterrent for crime, which is one idea often used to support it. Even publicly airing the executions has made no difference in the criminal community.

 

I think the bottom line is that we use capital punishment for revenge, not justice. And it does mean that we have "legal murder." I don't think it makes sense. If we, as a society, profess that taking the life of another person willfully is wrong, then I don't think we have any grounds to do it as punishment. So long as prison is an option, I think we should use it instead.

As stated, capital punishment doesn't work as a deterrent currently because the criminal doesn't believe it will ever happen. Most sit on death row until they die of natural causes. Lethal injection shouldn't be costly but if that cost is too much go back to firing squad. Never know who got the killing shot so there is less guilt involved with the executor and a bullet is actually really cheap. Use some crack shot gunsmen and death will be relatively painless.

 

My belief is if someone takes someone's life they are willing forfeiting their right to life so society does have a right to take it for the good of others. We have spent unknown amounts of money trying to rehabilitate violent criminals and to what end? Just being in prison causes most inmates to become more violent so they are never able to reenter society. That is why we have career criminals. Prison creates worse criminals and that is something that needs to be corrected. Right now we don't know how to rehabilitate the petty criminal let along the violent ones. The death penalty removes a violent individual off the streets and it is a kindness in that it prevents further suffering of the criminal by being locked up.

[The Evil Doer]

The person getting executed has to have their family watch on the other side of the glass, dude thats sick! So the other family of the killer doesn't matter, heck they don't exist apparently, the killer has no family.

 

Thats someone's dad or mom or brother or granfather they have to sit and watch them die thats pretty cruel. See half the time the victims family doesn't see their loved one killed most do but to have a pregnant woman watch her husband die in front wtf is she gonna tell the kid, "Oh your dad was executed...." WTF!!!!!! what is that!?

 

Mostly a few southern states still have a racist thing going.

 

Dude I'm Jehovah's Witness and I know for sure and can tell the difference man nothing like what you showed me can ever change my mind, Have you heard of the extreme opposition witnesses recieve in other countries? A woman in the country of goeriga had her unborn child killed when presits from a church raided the kingdom hall how sick is that?!

Simply put, you are wrong !!! Family members of a criminal being executed may choose to witness it or to have nothing to do with it, their choice, nobody forces them to watch it.

[AlternateMew]

The person getting executed has to have their family watch on the other side of the glass, dude thats sick! So the other family of the killer doesn't matter, heck they don't exist apparently, the killer has no family.

 

Thats someone's dad or mom or brother or granfather they have to sit and watch them die thats pretty cruel. See half the time the victims family doesn't see their loved one killed most do but to have a pregnant woman watch her husband die in front wtf is she gonna tell the kid, "Oh your dad was executed...." WTF!!!!!! what is that!?

 

Mostly a few southern states still have a racist thing going.

 

Dude I'm Jehovah's Witness and I know for sure and can tell the difference man nothing like what you showed me can ever change my mind, Have you heard of the extreme opposition witnesses recieve in other countries? A woman in the country of goeriga had her unborn child killed when presits from a church raided the kingdom hall how sick is that?!

Did they have a choice of whether to watch or not? If not, then wow. That's truly cruel. There's no call for that. If they did have a choice and chose to see their relative's final moments, that's one thing. But forcing them to see an execution of a loved one is flat-out wrong.

[Silverwingwyvren]

Not in all states some you are required to stand there and watch, it happened to a friend of mine so I know first hand.

 

Death is just a way out of it, it keeps you from facing up to it. Making it swift and speed wont help either, in fact the death penalty doesn't even keep killers from killing so why have it?

[Sir Barton]

The person getting executed has to have their family watch on the other side of the glass, dude thats sick! So the other family of the killer doesn't matter, heck they don't exist apparently, the killer has no family.

 

Thats someone's dad or mom or brother or granfather they have to sit and watch them die thats pretty cruel. See half the time the victims family doesn't see their loved one killed most do but to have a pregnant woman watch her husband die in front wtf is she gonna tell the kid, "Oh your dad was executed...." WTF!!!!!! what is that!?

 

From what I was just reading victim witnesses, police witness and press witnesses are usually involved. Some states allow citizen witnesses. I have yet to come across a state that requires the accused family to witness the execution so where are you getting that from? And still, the accused brought the suffering into his or her own family so that is who is to blame. I am more concerned about the victim's family and their pain and suffering.

[The Evil Doer]

Not in all states some you are required to stand there and watch, it happened to a friend of mine so I know first hand.

 

Death is just a way out of it, it keeps you from facing up to it. Making it swift and speed wont help either, in fact the death penalty doesn't even keep killers from killing so why have it?

I dont know what your friend told you but its false, family members arent forced to watch executions.

 

That only happens in a few arab countries and only for certain crimes.

[Kelkelen]

 

How so ? Dead is worse than alive and still taunting you ? Having a constant reminder of something horrific or trying to put it behind you ?

What about the victim's family ? should we allow the killer to mail them and keep messing with them, to maybe train others to kill as he did ? What about their peace of mind ?

 

 

 

Yeah, I would also like to live in a world where there is no crime, starvation or diseases, where its all peachy however thats not the reality of things so "collateral damage" is a reality, we dont like it, but we accept it..

 

 

 

Thats why it should be a speedy process, no appeals, just take him out, like they did back in the days, saves the drama 

 

 

 

Ohh, really ? You dont think thats because it takes ages to execute someone ?

In some countries where its done swiftly, crime rates went down rapidly.

 

 

 

Revenge ? Isnt revenge usually a personal act ?

Yes, if I were the relative of the murderer, it would still be worse for me to have my relative killed, possibly with their death publicized, than for me to know they were in prison. I am innocent. If my brother kills someone, I would still not want to suffer the execution of my brother, in addition to already suffering from knowing he's committed that crime, and him being locked away for life. (I'm not speaking very far from personal experience, on this one.) I honestly see no reason to feel *less* empathy for the criminal's family than for the victim's. They are probably quite unrelated to the crime, and are suffering the loss of someone they knew, or *thought* they knew, and something like a relative committing a murder sends deep ripples through the entire family, all of whom are (in the vast majority of cases) just as innocent as the victim's family.

 

And no, we don't need to allow the killer to mail the victim's family! Keeping him alive doesn't mean permitting him unrestrained access to things like mail or telephones. Killers don't generally teach others to kill as they did, since it takes a certain initial mindset to become a killer to begin with, and they usually had a specific target in mind; they aren't just encouraging others to kill people at random.

 

"Collateral damage" is still a concept of necessity. If we are capable of imprisoning people for life, there is no need to *risk* collateral damage. Why risk the taking of innocent lives if you don't *have* to?

 

Making it a speedy process wouldn't make it less expensive.

 

No, I don't think the lack of deterrent factor is related to its rarity. Criminals still know that, even without the death penalty in the picture, they're risking 20 years in prison, without access to the outside world, with a high possibility of being raped, and they continue to commit crimes. And in situations when an execution is publicized (happened once when I was in high school, for instance), studies haven't shown any significant reactions in those areas, even in direct response while the memory is "fresh in their minds." For people who are messed-up in the head, or who are addicted to something, almost nothing works as a deterrent unless it is literally an *immediate* consequence.

 

What countries? Was it a change from previous laws? What other sentences existed? Did the crime rates remain down? It would be really interesting to see how this worked, and assess why the reactions are different in the U.S.

 

No. Revenge can be societal, cultural. Whenever a criminal is executed, a criminal who could *easily* be kept locked in a cell for life, there's no motive of necessity. The motive is just to make everyone else feel better because those people *want* the criminal dead. That, to me, seems like revenge.

Edited December 2, 2011 by Kelkelen