Fake Low Gen Tinsels

[Khymarea]

I've traded for them before, but only because of the novelty of it. I tend to collect and breed for trade, but these Tinsels I collected just for the sake of having them because they were well done.

 

http://dragcave.net/lineage/78A9U and http://dragcave.net/lineage/gOEaL are the ones I have... honestly, I may do a lineage with them at some point if I can get matching mates for these two (both are female). They're very pretty, IMO.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Khymarea

[skauble]

I don't see a problem with altering the appearance of a dragon's lineage like that. I even think that the ones that incorporate tombstones on purpose can be very pretty and I've considered giving such lineage projects a go.

 

My problem is claiming that it's a 2nd gen or 3rd gen, etc. I think that's disingenuous and that it can confuse newer players. If it's now a 3rd gen because it's a deadline, then why not just say that. Claiming it as a straight out 3rd gen is not only confusing, IMO, but it's flat out incorrect.

 

The issues with 'fake' lo gens is well.. what happens if someone's scroll along the line has been burned? Such is actually what happened to two of my reds. One of them was from a nice pure short ladder lineage and I was going to try and continue such...

IIRC, dragons from burned scrolls get released, not killed. Therefore, when someone's scroll is burned, the dragons will be labeled as wild dragons, not show up as tombstones. Of course, someone might kill their dragons and, by coincidence, also have their scroll burned for some kind of rule violation, but the scroll burning shouldn't kill the dragons. After all, the scroll is just a player's record of their dragons.

[zaverxi]

Planning on making a separate thread about deadlines but this one's basically the purpose I was intending anyway.

 

 

I've noticed that it's become very popular lately to do this for lines, to make them worth more. I think it's horrible, since it involves killing a dragon, a rare one at that, just to make things pretty, and to try and get more out of people than what it's worth. Doing this and claiming it's 4th, 3rd, or even 2nd gen is really wrong.

 

 

I do admit that there's some people out there that like how these look and deliberately seek them out, but I hate the idea personally, especially when people are lying to get, say, a CB gold for a 'second gen tinsel' when it's probably like a 13th gen with murdered ancestors.

[Shadowdrake]

Claiming a tinsel is legit 2nd-gen when it's not is rather like trying to scam, if you ask me. The killing part doesn't bother me (considering zombies, vampires and neglecteds) even if they're rare. I've made some false 2nd-gen hybrids from messy parents, and am planning to make some fake 2nd-gens with the messiest tinsels I currently have, since that's the closest I'll ever get to CB tinsels (although it'd be closer if the dead eventually disappeared). Not planning to breed the fakes, not for trading or even lineages.

[Draco Knight]

Planning on making a separate thread about deadlines but this one's basically the purpose I was intending anyway.

 

 

I've noticed that it's become very popular lately to do this for lines, to make them worth more. I think it's horrible, since it involves killing a dragon, a rare one at that, just to make things pretty, and to try and get more out of people than what it's worth. Doing this and claiming it's 4th, 3rd, or even 2nd gen is really wrong.

 

 

I do admit that there's some people out there that like how these look and deliberately seek them out, but I hate the idea personally, especially when people are lying to get, say, a CB gold for a 'second gen tinsel' when it's probably like a 13th gen with murdered ancestors.

It's not like people are being tricked into trading for false low gens. Most trades I've seen with deadlines clearly say they are dead lines. Even if they don't, you can check the lineage before trading, which is common sense anyway.

[kerrikins]

Planning on making a separate thread about deadlines but this one's basically the purpose I was intending anyway.

 

 

I've noticed that it's become very popular lately to do this for lines, to make them worth more. I think it's horrible, since it involves killing a dragon, a rare one at that, just to make things pretty, and to try and get more out of people than what it's worth. Doing this and claiming it's 4th, 3rd, or even 2nd gen is really wrong.

 

 

I do admit that there's some people out there that like how these look and deliberately seek them out, but I hate the idea personally, especially when people are lying to get, say, a CB gold for a 'second gen tinsel' when it's probably like a 13th gen with murdered ancestors.

This comes up over and over and I... have yet to see this claim actually happen? o_O I think I've had one person claim a 2nd gen when they had a deadline and they were new and didn't know. Most people are fully aware of deadlines and do not try to present them as low gen nor would they get tricked into thinking that deadlines are low gen.

[Riverwillows]

Only problem I have with deadlines, is when people put them in trades, then don't mention its a deadline.

 

I mean, us older folk know but not newbies, and someone could end up feeling scammed.

[DragonNighthowler]

just to make things pretty, and to try and get more out of people than what it's worth.

The worth of a dragon is whatever people are willing to pay for them. If people are willing to give me a CB silver for a doctored third gen, why shouldn't I accept it?

[Kiyoura]

A fake is a fake and all it does is DE-value the real low-gens around. Someone could even fake up a CB - then of what value are the real ones? The people winning the REAL CB Tinsels earned them - those who fake low-gens or ersatz CB's did not.

Earned them?? Really? When all they had to do was participate in an event to enter a raffle. That's nothing compared to the time and work put into breeding the Tinsels and killing it. :S Building a deadline Tinsel lineage is like building any other lineage.

 

Anyways, my opinion on deadline tinsels: I only like them when they're even gens. I do not like or want stairsteps with a dead tinsel.

 

I've actually made these 2 lineages: Bronze and a Silver

 

What I don't like is when people call a tinsel "2nd gen" when actually it's a third gen with both starter dragons killed. :\

 

Also: I doctor lineages of golds, rares, and random lineages, too, although I never ever kill CBs or pretty lineages on purpose.

Edited March 31, 2013 by kiyoura

[Fiona]

Interesting that this should pop up right now, as I just posted a trade in the metals thread offering a "third gen" that has three out of four grandparents that are tombstones. http://dragcave.net/lineage/wWPHS

 

Posted as a doctored lineage with "3nd gen even" in quotes, because I believe that it's ok to offer these, but one should be clear what they are in the post, even though the lineage is also posted and can be accessed through the trade link.

 

 

The really weird thing is, though I've thought about doctoring lineages, I've never actually done it. I own neither of the sets of grandparents of this egg, which are owned by different people. The alt black was orphaned long before the silver. I was checking lineages of my alt blacks one day looking for something and discovered the change. It'd been long enough at that point that I couldn't access beyond the tombstones.

 

Then I was checking which of my messy silvers was not too messy to try to find a breeding partner for, and found she had lost her father. I decided they made a good pair.

[Snowytoshi]

I don't see what's wrong with deadlines? People can do what they want with their dragons and there's some instances of them, in which it actually looks really cool

 

Most people know that deadlines exist and won't get scammed (quite frankly I've never even seen a scam) and if they want to pay a CB Gold for a fake 2G tinsel (providing that they are aware of deadlines) it's no business of your's.

[dothefreddy]

I've got a "3rd gen" dead line shimmer. Person traded me was upfront about it and as I plan on trading the eggs I breed I plan on doing the same. I've never seen anyone claim anything else on a dead line.

[DarkEternity]

TJ has 'fixed' lineages so you can see past the dead dragons...

Thus permanently ruining some perfectly good lineages.

I made some true deadlined 2nd gens before the deadline 'fix' was implemented.

http://dragcave.net/lineage/80b6u

http://dragcave.net/lineage/FoB9Q

[DragonNighthowler]

TJ has 'fixed' lineages so you can see past the dead dragons...

Thus permanently ruining some perfectly good lineages.

I made some true deadlined 2nd gens before the deadline 'fix' was implemented.

http://dragcave.net/lineage/80b6u

http://dragcave.net/lineage/FoB9Q

What does this mean? That all deadlines will now show the ancestors? Or only those created after the "fix" was implemented?

[DarkEternity]

What does this mean? That all deadlines will now show the ancestors? Or only those created after the "fix" was implemented?

This dragon: http://dragcave.net/view/n/Santa

Has been dead for at least two months. Look at what happens on the offspring's page. The same thing occurs with dothefreddy's shimmer; or it WILL occur.

[DragonNighthowler]

This dragon: http://dragcave.net/view/n/Santa

Has been dead for at least two months. Look at what happens on the offspring's page. The same thing occurs with dothefreddy's shimmer; or it WILL occur.

I'm sorry but I don't get it. That dragon was a CB, so I'm not sure what should happen that isn't happening right now.

*feels stupid*

[kerrikins]

http://dragcave.net/lineage/h9nI

 

Here is a better example. You can see one is simply labelled 'deceased' but the other one has a name and you can click on it and then go to its view page and then click lineage. The one dragon is the 'old' deceased and the one called Hint Of Autumn is the new deadline result.

[Bu-tan]

Ah, so more or less the ones that are now 'fixed' in a way, actually retain the name and what dragon they 'are' so you can actually see the lineage of it before it was killed. Interesting. So, at least from a lineage perspective, it still 'drops' the lineage after the tombstone, but you're free to see what lineage the dead dragon had before death.

 

 

Still wouldn't really stop many from making deadlines and I've honestly been wanting a few myself just because I find them morbidly interesting. I've just not got around to making my own.

Edited March 31, 2013 by Bu-tan

[DragonNighthowler]

http://dragcave.net/lineage/h9nI

 

Here is a better example. You can see one is simply labelled 'deceased' but the other one has a name and you can click on it and then go to its view page and then click lineage. The one dragon is the 'old' deceased and the one called Hint Of Autumn is the new deadline result.

Ah, so they retain their lineage and such. Ok, I get it.

[Snowytoshi]

Ah, so they retain their lineage and such. Ok, I get it.

Are you sure that's not a zombie?

[Bu-tan]

Unless they got extremely lucky that it turned, that dragon was killed in February of this year. Chances of it being a zombie are super slim.

 

ETA: As far as I know it's not possible to make one outside of the appropriate month. Santa was also killed just in January of this year too. I can check in a few hours though to solve that mystery.

Edited March 31, 2013 by Bu-tan

[Snowytoshi]

Unless they got extremely lucky that it turned, that dragon was killed in February of this year. Chances of it being a zombie are super slim.

 

ETA: As far as I know it's not possible to make one outside of the appropriate month. Santa was also killed just in January of this year too. I can check in a few hours though to solve that mystery.

You can make zombies outside of October, the chances just happen to be very small...

[DarkEternity]

You can make zombies outside of October, the chances just happen to be very small...

I've never seen it happen a single time in 3 years and nobody has ever managed to produce EVIDENCE that this statment is true ever.

[Bu-tan]

As it is now past midnight and the sprites have not changed. You can safely say that no, those two example dragons are NOT zombies. So yes. Dark is right and dead dragons can now be clicked on to show their original lineages, but the lineage still drops off just like is used to.

 

I still don't think it's gonna deter much in the way of making deadlines. In fact, I almost wanna start collecting them now just cause it amuses me that much more to know I can go poking to see how they made it and from what. I've always had a small interest in them anyway though.

 

 

[Tawanda001]

I've never seen anyone claim anything else on a dead line.

I've been irritated to click on a trade link for a 2nd or 3rd gen trade offer only to find it's a deadline when I look at the lineage. Nary a peep about it in the their post. One person did it often enough that I simply quit looking at anything they had to offer.

I've also seen enough newbs ask questions about why would someone "kill CB tinsels/metals" to know they that have no clue about deadlines. For every one that asks there are probably a half dozen more that are just as confused but don't ask.

I prefer to be able to click on the tombstones and see the lineage. It's interesting to see what was trimmed away.