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White-Sword-Master

Ways to Reduce Viewbombing Attempts

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I would like *something* to be done here, but I fear it's a losing battle. As has been stated by TJ himself, there already exists an API for fansites to only allow signed-in users to add (their own) dragons. The problem is that getting ALL fansites to actually USE it would be virtually impossible.

 

I most *definitely* am in favor of a *clearer* 'no aid' message, something that actually explains *what* it is that's not being allowed. That would hopefully cut back drastically on the "just trying to help" or "honestly didn't know better" groups. But of course it wouldn't stop/deter deliberate viewbombers.

 

An easier way to fog would be nice; A "fog all" would be wonderful when you have 12+ growing creatures!

 

I would *like* to suggest a scroll-option that only allows growing creatures to get views when you *want* them to; For example, a checkbox that you could unmark before bed, so that your creatures wouldn't get viewbombed while you are asleep. Or even an "only allow views to count when I'm logged in" or something. But I know that suggestion is a little too out-there.

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I would like *something* to be done here, but I fear it's a losing battle. As has been stated by TJ himself, there already exists an API for fansites to only allow signed-in users to add (their own) dragons. The problem is that getting ALL fansites to actually USE it would be virtually impossible.

Saying "it can be done" and then throwing the responsibility over to them is a cop out, IMO. The system shouldn't rely on 3rd party adherence to the rules. If people'd adhere to the rules, we wouldn't need the system in the first part.

 

Why not just make it so that non-ER eggs/hatchlings can't get more than a certain amount of views per hour at maximum?

That would (should) prevent someone from killing your eggs, but not from hatching them.

 

I was going to wait until the egg was low-time to hatch it to give me more time to look for a trade.

Edited by rayden54

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Wow I never realized this was a problem. I never trade except a few weeks back I grabbed a cave bred silver, Shocked me, I thought I would try my hand at trading, and promptly got about 30 messages about the egg.

It was amazing. And suddenly the egg was sick, I just figured it was from people viewing it in the trade thread. Then a friend told me that people will actually try to kill an egg if it is a rare and they cannot get it.

ohmy.gif Seriously, Dragon Cave is supposed to be a nice friendly game.

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NO WAY !

 

I have just blitzed some tinsels who were being awkward with about 1000 views in an hour. WE need to be able to do that. For - ahem - other reasons too....

 

I think the only way is vigilance. And hiding things we are concerned about overnight, for instance.

Please don't limit the views that eggs/hatchies can receive. It has plenty of legitimate uses as well. If I'm afraid that people will kill my eggs or hatclings, I fog them until they are ER, add them to fansites and manually viewbomb them so they grow up safely - and I am thus assured that they are safe.

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Please don't limit the views that eggs/hatchies can receive. It has plenty of legitimate uses as well. If I'm afraid that people will kill my eggs or hatclings, I fog them until they are ER, add them to fansites and manually viewbomb them so they grow up safely - and I am thus assured that they are safe.

The suggestion was to limit the amount of views a non-ER egg or non-ER hatchling can receive in an hour. So, no, ER eggs/hatchies are not affected.

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The suggestion was to limit the amount of views a non-ER egg or non-ER hatchling can receive in an hour. So, no, ER eggs/hatchies are not affected.

I'm in two minds about it.

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I personally think that instances of true viewbombing are rare enough that I really do not want to have to jump through hoops to get my eggs views. And all of these proposed security measures do nothing to prevent people from viewbombing in forums, and sites similar to yarolds. I was here before there were any fansites, and there were deaths from intentional viewbombings then too. Now I wouldn't necessarily mind if this was a third option(NOT tied to the general "doesn't accept aid" message, I don't want aid, but don't want the extra security measures).

Forums you might be able to but though yarolds, you can't really view bomb an egg that way anymore, not even linking directly. The only way is though intense amount of views and unless you bounce the scroll though 3 or more accounts on yarolds, you can't really view bomb on yarolds. The traffic on yarolds is slow but steady, so it's quite hard to viewbomb. If someone did do the bouncing thing, then they'd be probably looking at a nice vacation from yarolds. ( a nice ban from yarolds)

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Forums you might be able to but though yarolds, you can't really view bomb an egg that way anymore, not even linking directly.  The only way is though intense amount of views and unless you bounce the scroll though 3 or more accounts on yarolds, you can't really view bomb on yarolds. The traffic on yarolds is slow but steady, so it's quite hard to viewbomb. If someone did do the bouncing thing, then they'd be probably looking at a nice vacation from yarolds. ( a nice ban from yarolds)

I will point out that I posted that nearly two years ago, and yes, at one point in time people DID use Yarolds for veiwbombing, because someone admitted to seeing it and didn't inform the victim because they didn't like them(this was back when the venting topic was there in Site Discussion).

 

Regardless, I still don't want to jump through hoops to get my eggs posted, I would rather there be other measures, like easier fogging, or a guardiang BSA that protects eggs/hatchlings.

Edited by Nectaris

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Changed my mind. I support it.

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/support

My password autofills itself on Soti. It doesn't take me any extra time or clicks to add my eggs.

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*reads some of thread*

 

What about a fresh thread and a poll that only deals with one idea, as this topic ended up branching into a forum where many different ideas were proposed? (limiting views, etc.)

Edited by missy_

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yes this needs to be a thing

 

sickness while it challenges the user is the root of view bombing

so if sickness is just removed then viewbombers cant kill your eggs

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I do agree with this. Also how about this?I had an idea after these eggs started dropping but not sure if it would be good or not.Here it is ok Guardians of Nature could help in keeping eggs safe from egg bombing if the user is not on at the time of the eggs getting sick. The Guardians of Nature dragons would help by destriduting the views to all the dragons. Or they would keep the eggs from being egg bombed some how not sure how it would work though.

Edited by Laryal

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Well, personally, since even with the fansites left out of it, off-site Viewbombing would still be a problem, I'd like to see a Fog/UnFog All scroll option, so we're not manually, one-at-a-time Fogging and UnFogging up to 21 dragons possibly several times a day, which is a particular pain with a slow connection, in lag, or when in a hurry, and an optional protection for eggs on Teleport, although I gather from a comment made on this thread that TJ had some issue with that some years back, which may or may not still obtain.

 

It's a pain in the rear, but I don't leave posted trades up when I can't watch them - I break the Teleport to Fog them along with the rest of my dragons every 'night' (a lot of my 'nights' happen in daylight, lol,) before going to sleep, except for gifts which I expect to be taken shortly or dragons growing up within the next few hours. It would be nice if something so important to basic dragon safety/survival could be made to be more practical in application.

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sickness while it challenges the user is the root of view bombing

so if sickness is just removed then viewbombers cant kill your eggs

This would be the simplest solution.

 

Really, is there any benefit to sickness and deaths resulting from sickness? Most of us know better than to hurt our own eggs that badly, so this mechanism has been changed from a (very small) additional challenge into a weapon.

 

Does DC really need a weapon against growing/hatching dragons?

 

Personally, I don't think so. But even if the mechanism of sickness/death needs to stay for a reason, whatever that reason may be, we need an easy way to defend us. Since even hiding your scroll is no guarantee against viewbombing of single eggs, we'd desperately need ways to avoid being viewbombed, for example:

  • multi-fogging. Quick and easy.
  • protection for eggs/hatchlings in teleports. Protect what cannot be hidden.
  • alternately, we need a BSA that protects chosen eggs/hatchis from sickness/death, even if they are in a teleport link. The BSA needs to be for a very common dragon, maybe more than just one. (Guardian, White)
Edited by olympe

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[snip]

[*]alternately, we need a BSA that protects chosen eggs/hatchis from sickness/death, even if they are in a teleport link. The BSA needs to be for a very common dragon, maybe more than just one. (Guardian, White)

 

I like the BSA idea a lot. I think the cooldown should be short as well, probably 2 days like Magis.

 

Edit to say that I do support API on the hatch sites. That wouldn't bug me at all.

Edited by xxBurningxx

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This would be the simplest solution.

 

Really, is there any benefit to sickness and deaths resulting from sickness? Most of us know better than to hurt our own eggs that badly, so this mechanism has been changed from a (very small) additional challenge into a weapon.

 

Does DC really need a weapon against growing/hatching dragons?

 

Personally, I don't think so. But even if the mechanism of sickness/death needs to stay for a reason, whatever that reason may be, we need an easy way to defend us. Since even hiding your scroll is no guarantee against viewbombing of single eggs, we'd desperately need ways to avoid being viewbombed, for example:

  • multi-fogging. Quick and easy.
  • protection for eggs/hatchlings in teleports. Protect what cannot be hidden.
  • alternately, we need a BSA that protects chosen eggs/hatchis from sickness/death, even if they are in a teleport link. The BSA needs to be for a very common dragon, maybe more than just one. (Guardian, White)

but the BSA isn't sound

if sickness is removed (i have never lost a egg to sickness without viewbombing even as a noob so this is almost useless) then the worst thing a view bomber could do is make trade eggs/hatchies grow up

 

the pros

the worst a bregger could do is annoy you

 

no more viewbomb deaths

 

no longer will we have to hide rare eggs when we just want to gaze at our luck and be happy

 

the fog button could be removed and replaced with something cooler and more useful

 

neglecteds will not die unless they don't get enough views

 

viewbombing wont be a big problem

 

 

cons

 

will lose some challenge

 

 

neglecteds will not die unless they don't get enough views

 

 

you can ignore your eggs more then you already do

 

egg spam will become a little more common

 

 

arguments to the cons:

 

have you really been challenged by sickness without vewbombing?

the real Challenge is hunting anyway so no one really cares

 

where they meant to be rare and sought after? no thye where made to be a bad thing plus they are still pretty annoying to make anyway and they need a TON of views

 

don't we already? pop em in EATW and have some luck and you can go on vacation and come back to them being fine

 

not many do and if it did become a problem limit how many views/ect they can get in a day first they can't abuse it

plus way more people have viewbombed or been viewbombed then those who have egg spammed without consequences

 

 

 

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but the BSA isn't sound *snip*

Depends on whether you use it to cure sickness (Heal BSA for whites) or whether you can use it as a preemptive measure so sickness doesn't even occur (Guard BSA for guardians). In the current situation, both kinds of BSAs would help to some extent, although the Guard BSA would probably be the one used more often - just in case someone gets any ideas.

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Depends on whether you use it to cure sickness (Heal BSA for whites) or whether you can use it as a preemptive measure so sickness doesn't even occur (Guard BSA for guardians). In the current situation, both kinds of BSAs would help to some extent, although the Guard BSA would probably be the one used more often - just in case someone gets any ideas.

but then people without a available BSA user are still wide open to attacks

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but then people without a available BSA user are still wide open to attacks

Well then they resort to the old ways of protecting themselves (ie, hiding scroll and fogging all growing things) until they can get their hands on some of said BSA dragons. Plus, if the cooldown is short like I said, then even just a few of the BSA dragons would suffice to protect the most important things on their scroll.

 

Edit: Also, that argument in and of itself is a bit vague, don't you think? I mean, that's the case for all BSAs, both ones that already exist as well as suggested ones. "What do people without [insert BSA here] do?" Well, they just don't have the option to use that BSA, simple as that.

Edited by xxBurningxx

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but then people without a available BSA user are still wide open to attacks

Well, if you have a better idea in case death of sickness stays an issue, feel free to share it. wink.gif

 

If you have no BSAs to use, you can still do whatever you do now to protect yourself. Personally, if I have a very valuable leetle one on my scroll, I keep it fogged around the clock until it's ER-able. Then I unfog, hatch and refog until the hatchling is ER, too. Sure, this sucks - especially if you need to do this with all of your up to 21 growing things. But that's why people will be motivated to pick up the BSA dragons in the first place. Which is good, because both guardians and whites are pretty common to begin with. Especially guardians.

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so if sickness is just removed then viewbombers cant kill your eggs

I support removing 'death from sickness'.

 

Sickness/death was intended as an extra challenge, something that got you more involved in the game since you couldn't just drop your eggs in a hatchery at 7d and leave them. As a challenge, it contributed to the fun of the game. Since then though, it's become a weapon for trolls to use against people they don't agree with, or against people who have more luck catching. In short: it's non longer fun.

 

So I say: remove death from sickness (but leave death from no time, earthquakes and bites be).

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I like the idea of having defenses against view-bombing. The ones listed by Olype are good, but others I'd like to see:

 

- Selecting what to hide. I'd love to be able to hide my eggs, but let anyone see growing hatchies and adults / frozens. Simply put, its really hard to kill a hatchy with viewbombing.... even if you are trying.

- Give hatcheries the option to see hidden things on a scroll via the API log-in. This would reduce the hassle of having a hidden scroll.

- The Guard BSA, where you can set a dragon to guard over a specific egg. The honest truth is, if you hide your scroll, most view-bombers can't find your dragons to view-bomb them.... so then its mostly the really special ones that are at risk of being found: Certain CBs or offspring of heavily stalked dragons

- Remove growing dragons from their parent's progeny page until they are no longer growing: this is an important one, because even if your scroll is hidden, if someone knows the parent they can find and kill your egg, at least as it currently is.

 

So while simply removing killing via views would be simplest, or limiting total number of views possible, that also means that people can toss as much strain on the servers AND hatcheries as they feel like it.... with no consequence. So I think death by views has to stay because:

  • Protect the integrity of the server
  • Make people actually pay attention to growing their dragons
  • Let people intentionally view-bomb their own eggs / hatchies: there are times when its desirable to do
  • Protect the integrity of the hatcheries: they are already slow, due to number of eggs vs those giving views

 

But I think we need some sort of protection to keep viewbombing from being used as a weapon, which it is now. So I think we need:

  • Multi-fogging. Quick and easy.
  • Half-fog eggs in teleport: you can see and trade them but they can't gain views
  • BSAs: Guard, lets you be pro-active with eggs most likely to attract attention
  • BSAs: Heal, it lets you help eggs that have attracted attention after the fact
  • Scroll hide options: lets you better show your scroll while protecting your growing thigns
  • Remove growing dragons from their parent's progeny page
  • API additions, so people can keep their scrolls hidden but can enter their eggs into hatcheries... if they have their own log-ins

For the objections to the BSAs of what do people who don't have said BSAs do... Simple. They have to get said BSA dragons if they want to use it. Its the same way with Influence, Teleport, and Incubate: if you don't have it.... that's a site functionality you can't use.

 

Cheers!

C4.

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Hide growing things on scroll. As an account setting. Reverse of the current "hide adults on scroll".

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I think giving Guardians a BSA that prevents sickness for, say, 24 hours would be amazing. It would give fresh eggs a chance to age, but still leave them vulnerable once the protection wears off, leaving some of the challenge. And it would make Guardians a lot more desirable, since as it is, they are one of the least liked dragons.

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