BSL do you agree?

[Keriel]

BSL or Breed specific legislation, is basically putting restrictions on or banning breeds of dogs due higher risk of dangerous behavior.

 

dogs like pit-bulls and rottweilers many people are aware of as being a known dangerous breed. but have you ever owned one?? they can be the most loving dogs in the world, and yet in some countries, will be put down even if they have never attacked a soul.

 

not only that, but would you believe the Labrador (the best known family dog by popular vote) is classified as a dangerous dog??

 

Do you think that maybe they've taken it a bit far to put complete bans on some breeds? i know i do.

 

list of banned breeds, subject to increasing in numbers. chances of dropping slim 75 and counting

 

(i look for a discussion and found nothing excet the BSL lineage)

[grimace]

>banning boxers, golden retrievers, and pugs.

 

I can't picture this ever passing.

[Keriel]

in some places there's already restrictions.

 

i don't mind owners having to get special licenses to own some breeds such as pitties, because they were bread to fight. but to ban them all together and kill them on site when they have committed no crime is wrong.

 

[Infinis]

The problem with dog behaviour is people. <__<

 

There are some really stupid, stupid people out there who train those dogs to be vicious for various reasons. I don't think training a dog to be a guard dog is bad, though.

 

Training a dog to be vicious for stupid reasons like dogfighting is what gives them their bad rep - like pit bulls. The problem with some of the larger breeds is that people can be naturally afraid of those ginormous dogs (like Rottweilers) and because they're bigger, some people assume their meaner for some reason (sometimes they are, but most definitely not always).

 

And we had a lab puppy once. He was lovable and cute and wonderful and floofy <3

 

@Keriel: Did you know the original American Pit Bull terrier was originally bred as a BABYSITTER because they had wonderful temperaments around children? They were NOT originally bred to fight.

[TikindiDragon]

People are the problem, not the dogs. Yes there are some dogs with slightly undesireable traits bred into them (like the Dobermann) but those can be overriden by good training and considerate ownership. I knew an old lady that had a dobie, and it was a wonderful calm dog.

 

We do have BSL in the UK. It's called the dangerous Dogs Act. Which, for some reason, doesn't include Staffies (which is a very popular breed of family dog over here). Personaly I'd rather see it repealed and the old Dog Liscencing brought back into play.

 

Any dog badly trained has the potential to be dangerous. Just as any dog well trained is extremely unlikely to pose a threat to anyone. It's definitively about training, not about breed.

[DarkLadyNyara]

The problem with dog behaviour is people. <__<

 

There are some really stupid, stupid people out there who train those dogs to be vicious for various reasons. I don't think training a dog to be a guard dog is bad, though.

 

Training a dog to be vicious for stupid reasons like dogfighting is what gives them their bad rep - like pit bulls. The problem with some of the larger breeds is that people can be naturally afraid of those ginormous dogs (like Rottweilers) and because they're bigger, some people assume their meaner for some reason (sometimes they are, but most definitely not always).

 

And we had a lab puppy once. He was lovable and cute and wonderful and floofy <3

 

@Keriel: Did you know the original American Pit Bull terrier was originally bred as a BABYSITTER because they had wonderful temperaments around children? They were NOT originally bred to fight.

QFT for all of this.

 

Especially the part about Pit Bulls. Before they got their reputation as "EVIL BLOODTHIRSTY DOGS OF EVIL! ", they were called "nanny dogs." Yeah..there's a breed that should inspire terror.

 

Honestly, any dog is dangerous if improperly trained. Children have been maimed by dachshunds, and chihuahuas can be made into vicious little ***s. It's not the fault of the dog, it's the fault of the owner. Or occasionally the fault of some idiot excuse for a parent who can't be bothered to teach their kid not to run up and smack strange (or really, any) dogs... but that's a rant for another time.

[Syaoransbear]

I definitely don't agree with it at all.

 

Lets see, you have a breed that visually looks intimidating, so all the thugs buy one, abuse it, and train it improperly and then you say the breed is the problem? Really? How does that make sense?

 

Owners aren't only to blame. Breeders need to take responsibility too and stop producing dogs with poor temperaments and low thresholds just to make money, and breeders doing it on purpose need to be shot. That is not a problem specific to certain dog breeds, it's a problem that can happen in all dog breeds. Breeds don't need to be banned, their breeding program just needs to be cleaned up.

 

I think it's pretty ridiculous to be banning breeds when dog attacks are quite rare, even in breeds that supposedly attack more often(which is usually just a case of mistaken identity. Any breed with a short coat and square head is labeled a 'pit bull' by the media). You are more likely to be attacked by a person than a dog.

[Kokay]

Holy smokes. If this stupid thing were to happen, I'd lose all my dogs. I've got a Belgian Malnois (with hip dysplasia which has turned her into the most timid thing I've ever seen, afraid of hurting herself I assume), a Siberian Husky (tolerant little thing she is, all she ever does is bark even if she's being mauled by children. Mind you, she only barks when she's kenneled), and a Labrador (best dog I've ever had, temperament is perfect- sassy at the worst, and she obeys better than any dog I've met).

 

What nonsense is this? I assume that the BSL thing is in our own 'free' country of America? *mentally launches into conspiracy plots by government against American people* I'll spare you though. I've argued with my parents numerous times, the breed doesn't make the dog bad. It's poor handling, training, pain, or chemical imbalances. I don't think for one second that my dogs would attack one of us. Except the Husky, I never liked her. She looks at me as though she's a timebomb, waiting to rip into my arm. But, then again, that's just my personal feelings on the dog. She has never shown any signs of aggression in reality.

 

At the worst, I would accept licensing for those owners who wish to have a said dog. It'd be simple to instate a sort of training program for people. Say, 4 months of training with their puppy under the watchful eye of a trainer. That would be easy, and a source of government income. There. Everyone is happy. But, going so far as to try and ban dogs famous for being house pets is foolish. (How would a pug be considered dangerous in the first place? Just kick it and there goes it's vicious attack. *shot* I don't like small dogs at all, but I don't truly condone animal cruelty. I just talk about it jokingly.)

 

Ah, but I feel it is my duty to point this out. That article was posted in 2008. It's been years and still, no law. My heart is rested.

Edited September 29, 2011 by Kokay

[TikindiDragon]

Ah, but I feel it is my duty to point this out. That article was posted in 2008. It's been years and still, no law. My heart is rested.

Oh there are laws, just not country wide. That list mentioned breeds that already had some sort of legislation against them somewhere in the States. Which, basicaly, means you need to do some very careful checking on city/state ordinances before you take your dogs anywhere.

[Kokay]

Oh yeah, I know that. Of course, I don't find that discriminating against the dogs specifically. (Though it is) I'm just used to it by now. There all over in Michigan. Camp sites won't let certain dogs in, etc. I just never thought of that as... Well, what it is.

[7Deadly$ins]

Oh yeah, I know that. Of course, I don't find that discriminating against the dogs specifically. (Though it is) I'm just used to it by now. There all over in Michigan. Camp sites won't let certain dogs in, etc. I just never thought of that as... Well, what it is.

You don't find it discriminating against the dogs specifically because...?

[dragon_mando]

The problem with dog behaviour is people. <__<

 

There are some really stupid, stupid people out there who train those dogs to be vicious for various reasons. I don't think training a dog to be a guard dog is bad, though.

 

Training a dog to be vicious for stupid reasons like dogfighting is what gives them their bad rep - like pit bulls. The problem with some of the larger breeds is that people can be naturally afraid of those ginormous dogs (like Rottweilers) and because they're bigger, some people assume their meaner for some reason (sometimes they are, but most definitely not always).

 

And we had a lab puppy once. He was lovable and cute and wonderful and floofy <3

 

@Keriel: Did you know the original American Pit Bull terrier was originally bred as a BABYSITTER because they had wonderful temperaments around children? They were NOT originally bred to fight.

This.

 

Out of all the dogs I've owned and spent a lot of time around, Pits, Rotties, Dobies, Labs, Schnauzers, Poodles, Yorkies, Pekanese, Pomeranians, and at least a half-dozen more, the ONLY dogI have EVER trusted around small children without an adult there was a mix I owned of the first three in that list. She was sweet and gentle with kids, nothing but energy and wanting to wrestle with me and smart to boot. She was even starting to learn to double-dutch jump rope at one point.

 

All the rest? Never. Especially the smaller dogs. From my personal experience, the smaller the dog, the more likely to attack a child.

[Fortune86]

Any animal can be vicious and dangerous. It's all down to the owner to train them properly.

 

In my street there's a woman with several of a small breed of dog (can never remember the breed, put it looks like a giant ball of wool on legs) who are the nastiest, yappiest creatures I know. They will bark at or go for anything.

 

Her reason for not training them? Apparently she thinks they are too small to do any real harm.

[TikindiDragon]

As someone who knocks on doors for a living (no, I don't sell anything) I can say without a doubt that it's the small dogs that present the biggest problems. Most of the dog bite incidents in my department have come from small dogs. Owners of large dogs either have them properly trained, or will say "Give me a minute, I'll just put the dog away.".

 

For some reason people think it's okay not to train a small dog properly, and that it's nothing to worry about if their small dog is growling at someone on thier doorstep.

 

Give me a nice, well trained rottie any day of the week.

[Fortune86]

We have medium to large dogs (five in total) and if the person at the door is someone we don't know we tend to leave one of them in hall and put the rest away.

 

When we open the door we open it a wedge and insert ourselves into the gap, although the dog of choice can usually stick their nose through the gap left by our legs. Our dogs are well trained enough not to try and push their way out and don't even bark when they see the person at the door. Most callers are okay with them being there although there have been a few that retreat a little way down the drive.

 

We do this because we live in a area where there have been a few thefts and someone was killed less than a year ago. As much as we understand that some people don't like dogs being there when they are trying to talk to you, we'd rather put up with their discomfort then be stabbed to death on our own front doorstep.

[Wookieinmashoo]

This is a great way to cause certain breeds to become extinct. Limit the people who can have them, reducing the breeders and reducing the gene pool

 

Yep,

are dangerous alright.

 

I wouldn't mind people having to have a certain license to own any dog because apparently some idiots have pretty much any dog into an aggressive animal. That might limit how many of them get adopted though, so it's probably not a good idea..

[TheDarkCynder]

http://www.dogsbite.org/

Relevant.

 

I disagree with that site, they have some pretty untrustworthy sources.

[Kokay]

I just don't. Looking at it closer, I realize it is, but I don't feel upset about it. Being raised into it, I feel no injustice towards it.

 

DarkCynder, I just looked at that site. It was incredible the statistics that they have against certain breeds. Hence, licensing. Regulate who can own a pit bull simply by their age and their family and nothing more. If they're elderly, obviously they can't own one. If they have young children, they can't own one. That would please both sides if both sides didn't want it positively their way. The anti-pit bull people would see that the people who are generally at risk would be protected by the license, and pro-pit bull people could still have their pit bulls. If you're old enough to get a Senior coffee at McDonald's, you're reaching too old to physically be able to control such a powerful and strong willed dog.

[philpot123]

If you've ever been to the dog pound, the pit bulls are some of the sweetest dogs in there. Saying that they're "evil" as a breed is ridiculous.

[dragon_mando]

If you've ever been to the dog pound, the pit bulls are some of the sweetest dogs in there. Saying that they're "evil" as a breed is ridiculous.

 

Exactly this. I went to the shelter a lot this spring and early summer, the pits were the only nice dogs in there this round. The labs, chihuahuas, Australian Shepherds? Mean and nasty, most of them. Yet moms were letting their kids stick their fingers through the chain link to those dogs but not the pits...then got mad at the staff when the visibly vicious dogs tried snapping at their wee ones.

[Kokay]

I've been to a dog pound. I've watched them. My friend owns a rescued pit bull. I can agree that individual dogs are incredibly lovable. But, I can also agree that by taking one on, you're taking on a lot more responsibility than you are taking on a, say, a Labrador. While both are strong dogs, pit bulls have their strength in their jaws. If you don't think that you could take down a dog if it became violent, then you don't need to put yourself in the position where you're near it. I know there are certain circumstances etc. But as a rule of thumb. In more than a few cases, I've had to subdue my dogs. They're medium sized and have iron strong will. But, I know that if I had to protect myself or someone else, I could control the animal. If you're too afraid of your dog biting you, you don't need it.

[Wookieinmashoo]

http://dogbitelaw.com/dog-bite-statistics/...ly-to-kill.html

 

Found this when looking for dog attack percentages. I can easily see people who are not good pet owners owning pit bulls. People think they look tough and so people stupidly train them to be so, which is probably the reason why pit bulls are constantly listed. It's stupid people thinking they are the dog of choice for this and so raises the amount of aggressive dogs of this breed. It has nothing to do with the dog breed, but how popular they are among a certain kind of people who train them to be aggressive.

 

Also that baby incident was completely the parent's fault. The dog probably only pawed it to death thinking it was something to play with. It's the idiot's fault for leaving the baby with the dog to begin with.

 

@Kokay: it doesn't matter the breed of dog or how they are built. If any dog wanted to attack someone or kill them, even a Labrador, they can. Adopting a dog is pretty much adopting any previous owners the dog had. You don't know what they did with the dog and since pit bulls are often mistreated, people point the finger at them.

Edited September 29, 2011 by Wookieinmashoo

[dragon_mando]

it doesn't matter the breed of dog or how they are built. If any dog wanted to attack someone or kill them, even a Labrador, they can.

 

Not aimed at me, but vouching for it. Labs are as scary as any other dog when they attack and I still have scars. Also ankle-biting yappers. "Too small to do damage" my back end. My grandmother's miniature schnauzer has done more damage to more kids that I want to mess with.

[Kokay]

Yes, I understand that. Fully. I own an abused rescue dog myself. Any dog can be violent and any dog can attack. It's your job as the owner of said dog, however, to subdue the animal. I feel that pit bulls may have a bit of genetic help in their aggression. There are certain breeds that were, indeed, bred for aggression. What they were used for shows that clearly. These breeds include, but are not limited to: Pit Bulls, German Shepherds, Rhodesian Ridgebacks, Bulldogs, Boxers, Rottweilers, and Doberman Pinschers. I've known many dogs of these breeds to be well behaved etc. But, they have certain... bodily enhancements to help them. Examples are Shepherds' teeth and the way their jowls are formed. Etc. etc. I could continue going on and on about chemical balances in the dogs, their genetics, and the environment they live in.

 

What surprises me deeply though, is how many people allow their dog to be Alpha without realizing it. Simple things like looking into the dogs eyes and you looking away before it does. Feeding it table scraps from dinner. Feeding it before you yourself eat. Letting it sleep in your bed with you. There are so many things that people don't understand about pack dynamics. If they don't educate themselves in them, they're putting themselves at risk. I've met many aggressive dogs in my time too. Never once have I been bitten. In my opinion, it's all in the way that you react and hold yourself when in the dog's presence.

[Walker]

On one side, they tell us to be cautious of all wild animals. Albiet, dogs aren't wild, but they are still animals, so I think it's actually kind of smart to be cautious of anything like that, no matter what breed. Just don't go up and pet any strange dog no matter what breed it is.

 

On the other hand, we are humanizing animals when we say BSL is 'discriminatory.' It's not like the dog knows there are laws against it living in a certain community. And we should't let our emotions of attachment completely overrule our common sense. I'm NOT saying it's common sense to outlaw a certain breed of dog. However, we also can't let ourselves become so convinced that a breed is discriminated against so unfairly against that we let our guard down while around an animal. If you're going to be banning a dog breed, ban all dogs. If you're going to own ANY breed of dog, be aware and cautious.