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I have some questions, I hope they don't offend anyone but I would like to hear an answer;

1. Why am I a sinner when I don't believe in it?

2. How am I satanic when I don't believe in neither of the 2 christian deities?

 

These are not targeted at any specific person.

 

Also I have 1 thing I want to say;

 

"I can't do that because of my religion" is fine, but "you can't do that because of my religion" isn't fine.

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I'm personally an Atheist.

No, I'm not a satanist. I'm not a minion of the Devil.

 

What devil?

 

I do find the way you phrased that a tad ironic. You say you don't believe in God, but the way you worded that post, it's like you're implying the devil is real, but you just aren't one of his minions. lol

 

I'm not sure if that's how you meant it, but I thought that was kind of funny. Obviously, if God isn't real the devil can't be either. smile.gif

 

1. Why am I a sinner when I don't believe in it?

 

You may be a sinner in the eyes of believers for whatever reason, and nothing can change the fact that other people have opinions and express them, but if you don't believe in a higher power yourself then who cares what anyone else thinks? It shouldn't matter to you a whit if, in your mind, such a thing as 'sin' doesn't exist.

 

2. How am I satanic when I don't believe in neither of the 2 christian deities?

 

Again, maybe others may think that about you, and again, if in your mind neither deity exists, who cares what others think? You should feel 100% confident and secure in your own mind about who and what you are. As long as you're at peace in your own heart and mind, that's what matters, not the labels of others. If someone says you've sinned, or are 'satanic' for whatever reason, simply blow it off as the bs you believe it to be and don't give it another thought. Why sweat something that, in your mind, doesn't exist?

Edited by MedievalMystic

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^It's possible to believe in the devil without believing in God, (at least in my opinion it is.)

 

((Personally, I find it much easier to believe in a system such as the one Terry Pratchett described in his book - every god someone believes in exists somewhere. Considering all the different beliefs out there, it makes more sense if all of them are real.))

 

 

 

((((Completely off-topic, but I just noticed that if you take the 'd' off 'devil', you get 'evil'. ohmy.gifxd.png ))))

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Hi everyone

 

I decided to add I am a me. It means I am unknowing, but I believe and respect people's belief. As well as follow a mix of beliefs which is what makes me feel comfortable and know what feels right to me

 

In that regard, I have been to Christian colleges, churches and studied many religions/beliefs. ( Wiccian ( white, black, green and blue sects), Shamanism, Taoism, even a few of the more taboo, Satanism to name one)

 

In all to me have basis to exist, it's like telling people there's no such things as ghosts, or explaining evolution without the missing link.

 

People will believe what they feel is correct. It's what makes us well us. I'm not here to debate ( though not bad with it) I'm not telling whos right and wrong.

Edited by KuroYukia

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I think this is the nearest thing to a civilised discussion on religion I've seen anywhere on the internet :3

 

I'm somewhere between atheism and agnosticism in a way I find very hard to describe >_< It doesn't quite feel true to say 'I don't believe in anything remotely resembling a god' but trying to explain what I do believe always comes across implying I really believe something which I don't - I just don't think that hard about it. I guess maybe I could call it 'atheist with fuzzy edges around the concept of 'luck' and extra respect for the possibility I could be wrong' tongue.gif

 

I wish I'd had better religious education in school with regard to non-Christian faiths, but for all our school was supposedly non-religious the headmaster was one of those people who thought Christianity was for everyone. In any case I'm quite thoroughly turned off the idea of following an organised religion, regardless of what my beliefs might or mightn't be.

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You may be a sinner in the eyes of believers for whatever reason, and nothing can change the fact that other people have opinions and express them, but if you don't believe in a higher power yourself then who cares what anyone else thinks? It shouldn't matter to you a whit if, in your mind, such a thing as 'sin' doesn't exist.

I mean, I don't call them farquaad, why should they call me a "sinner"?

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I mean, I don't call them farquaad, why should they call me a "sinner"?

This [on a larger scale] isn't really a problem with religion, it's a problem with people forcing their judgements out into the open and onto people who haven't asked for them.

 

People are welcome to think of me as a sinner for disbelieving. If we're actually having a conversation in that general direction they might even get away with telling me once. But once I know what they think and have told I'm not going to change the topic needs to be left behind or it becomes pure name-calling. The same applies to people who think my hair is stupid or that I wash up my dishes in the wrong order.

 

And they're welcome to stop hanging around with me if they don't want to hang around with a sinner/someone with stupid hair/someone who washes up wrong. Some people weren't meant to get on - that's not a problem it's a consensus.

Edited by ObsessedWithCats

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I mean, I don't call them farquaad, why should they call me a "sinner"?

 

The bottom line is that people are going to call you whatever they want to, when they want to, whether you like it or not and there's no stopping that. That doesn't mean you have to own it.

 

People can slap whatever labels they choose to on others. Does that make it truth? No, that makes it opinion.

 

As to the opinions of other people about me personally, well, they can call me names till the cows come home and I still sleep well at night. lol People can slap all the labels on me, or anyone else, that they please. I don't sweat it. Neither should you.

Edited by MedievalMystic

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They can be christians but they don't have to force their religion down my throat.

 

Is someone holding a gun to your head, forcing you to listen? And that's about anything. If you're in front of someone in RL that's talking censorkip.gif you don't want to listen to and/or don't gel with or believe in, turn your back and simply walk away. If someone is talking religion online and you're not down with those views or beliefs, stop reading it. Problem solved.

 

Nobody can 'force' anything on you unless you allow it.

Edited by MedievalMystic

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Is someone holding a gun to your head, forcing you to listen? And that's about anything. If you're in front of someone in RL that's talking censorkip.gif you don't want to listen to and/or don't gel with or believe in, turn your back and simply walk away. If someone is talking religion online and you're not down with those views or beliefs, stop reading it. Problem solved.

 

Nobody can 'force' anything on you unless you allow it.

When I hear "forcing religion" I think of people trying to mix church and state and make bibles a part of public school, etc.

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When I hear "forcing religion" I think of people trying to mix church and state and make bibles a part of public school, etc.

 

I'm 48 and went to public school. Bibles weren't part of the public school system then and as far as I know they aren't part of the public school system now, so even if religious people have pushed for that it hasn't worked yet. I can't see that actually happening. That would be forcing religion on people, obviously, and I wouldn't want to be anywhere near the uproar if people on the other side of the fence actually thought that would happen.. I don't think people need to worry...

 

..unless, of course, there's some news I've missed that's got people concerned about it actually happening...

 

 

Edited by MedievalMystic

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I'm 48 and went to public school. Bibles weren't part of the public school system then and as far as I know they aren't part of the public school system now, so even if religious people have pushed for that it hasn't worked yet. I can't see that actually happening. That would be forcing religion on people, obviously, and I wouldn't want to be anywhere near the uproar if people on the other side of the fence actually thought that would happen.. I don't think people need to worry...

 

..unless, of course, there's some news I've missed that's got people concerned about it actually happening...

The closest I've seen to "forcing religion" in public schools was in Orange County in Florida where some Christian group or other managed to pass a law allowing them to pass out tracts, religious texts, etc. in the schools.

 

Only they didn't exactly think of all the consequences... they forgot that if ONE religious group gets to give away handouts, so do ALL the religious groups. Following a Bible giveaway, an atheist group wanted to do their own giveaway but they ended up filing a lawsuit because the schools tried to ban some of the books they planned to offer. And then the Satanic Temple got in on the act, filing a formal request to pass out their own material, including a coloring book.

 

As I understand it, Orange County has since banned the distribution of any and all religious materials in schools.

 

Links: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyathei...-distributions/

 

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/features/ed...0210-story.html

 

http://wonkette.com/572482/satanic-temples...-day-in-florida

 

 

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Only they didn't exactly think of all the consequences... they forgot that if ONE religious group gets to give away handouts, so do ALL the religious groups. Following a Bible giveaway, an atheist group wanted to do their own giveaway but they ended up filing a lawsuit because the schools tried to ban some of the books they planned to offer. And then the Satanic Temple got in on the act, filing a formal request to pass out their own material, including a coloring book.

 

Lmao! I'm sorry, but that's hilarious. That gives new meaning to the words 'holy crap'. A coloring book? hahahahaha! What was the subject material the kiddies were to color? Dante's Inferno and demons? Guess they'd need to stock up on red crayons. hee hee

 

As I understand it, Orange County has since banned the distribution of any and all religious materials in schools.

 

That's probably for the best. lol

Edited by MedievalMystic

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I think I recall instances of some public schools down south having religious symbols displayed in school, and discriminating against students who practice faiths other than Christianity. I'll have to do a google search and see if I can find an article.

Edited by Omega Entity

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^^^ That's true. People get suspended/even expelled for this stuff. Smh. I don't judge based on religion. Personally, I'm an agnostic athiest. (i doubt there is a deity, but i could be wrong)

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Question, not directed at anyone in particular:

In Christian or Catholic religion, is it possible to not be a sinner- or to confess/repent/whatever it is that makes you a good person in your god's eyes- without believing in that deity yourself?

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I'm taught to be Lutheran, but to be honest, I don't feel an urge to be religious. Is that wrong?

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I'm taught to be Lutheran, but to be honest, I don't feel an urge to be religious. Is that wrong?

Of course not! Religion is an individual choice, and you don't have to follow what you were taught if you don't want to. If you want to identify Lutheran, that still doesn't mean you have to go to church every Sunday or any of the more involved activities.

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I'm taught to be Lutheran, but to be honest, I don't feel an urge to be religious. Is that wrong?

I was born and raised in the Lutheran faith and I've never really felt I was a part of it since I started thinking for myself. I enjoy the sense of community with religious people (aka why I'm currently a Wiccan and not an atheist) but I discovered I don't believe in any of the stuff the Lutherans teach. The church also opposes many things politically that I am for, such as abortion rights and gay marriage.

 

Basically I'm trying to say that it's perfectly okay for you to stay with a religion you don't believe in for the sake of the people or community, but leaving is your choice and yours alone and you should do what is best for you.

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More and more, I begin to feel that religion - for very many people - is more a stand-in for the club you're a member of rather than something to do with what they actually feel is right, and honestly believe in...

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I'm taught to be Lutheran, but to be honest, I don't feel an urge to be religious. Is that wrong?

I was raised Christian. I'm an agnostic athiest, but my family still tries to get me to go to church without knowing this... Its fine. My whole family is Christian. It really is a personal thing.

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Question, not directed at anyone in particular:

In Christian or Catholic religion, is it possible to not be a sinner- or to confess/repent/whatever it is that makes you a good person in your god's eyes- without believing in that deity yourself?

Let me explain my perspective on sin, as a professing Christian.

 

I believe we were created to be in a healthy spiritual relationship with God (and as part of that, with each other). I have heard sin defined as anything that comes between a person and God - anything that disrupts/prevents that healthy relationship.

 

All of us on earth have material bodies preventing us from having the full spiritual view of God. How/why our spirits wound up in physical bodies is a matter of debate; some argue that we existed spiritually before and took on/were put in physical bodies when we turned from God (metaphorically ate the apple), while others say we never existed before God created our spirit in the new physical body. Either way, we cannot readily see God (Creator, Holy Spirit) directly for ourselves, and our spirits cannot flourish without God. By our very nature (physical bodies), we are in a sinful condition. Thus, we need to turn to God to help us see, understand (at least some), and develop that healthy spiritual relationship. I believe God came to earth in the form of Jesus specifically as one means of reaching out to and teaching us.

 

Being good comes out of wanting to please God in the healthy relationship, much as you would want to do for any loved one. However, simply regretting/confessing/repenting of actions does not build a relationship in and of itself. We have to connect with the one we are in relationship with.

 

Here's a weak analogy: A person who never had a driving lesson gets in a car and causes an accident. That person can confess/repent/pay damages, but that does not make them a safe driver. They need driving lessons.

 

I am not saying you have to believe exactly what I do about God to have that relationship. Rather, I think everyone has a very unique relationship with God based on their own circumstances. While I find going to church spiritually nourishing, maybe you find hiking in mountains or crafting something to be fulfilling. The key in my mind, is that you recognize and connect with the higher power (that to me is God), building that spiritual relationship that will enable you to flourish beyond this world.

Edited by Awdz Bodkins

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