Religion

[Keriel]

i want an opinion.

 

i aam not religious i do not thin, i do not conform to a set of beliefs but... just to be strange and possibly crazy maybe needing to seek serious mental help (who am i kidding i need mental help regardless)

 

I belive one of my friends is a guardian angel. He is christian in essance but doesn't attend church. he tends to know things before i tell him despite being over the other side of the country (EG when one of the chicks fell ill. and again when a chick went missing) am I insane, deluded, and fooloing myself. or is it possible there is some truth to his claims

[skinst]

I don't think you're mentally insane. I don't think it's wrong to think of someone living as a guardian angel of sorts. Many people think that their deceased relatives are guardians (I personally believe my father is)

 

In short, believe whatever you wanna believe <3

[Dr. Paine]

i want an opinion.

 

i aam not religious i do not thin, i do not conform to a set of beliefs but... just to be strange and possibly crazy maybe needing to seek serious mental help (who am i kidding i need mental help regardless)

 

I belive one of my friends is a guardian angel. He is christian in essance but doesn't attend church. he tends to know things before i tell him despite being over the other side of the country (EG when one of the chicks fell ill. and again when a chick went missing) am I insane, deluded, and fooloing myself. or is it possible there is some truth to his claims

I honestly believe the same of my best friend. I agree with skinst- thinking of someone as a living guardian angel or whatever is fine and not a sign of madness.

[potterwolf]

Recently in the church that I attend (my family is Roman Catholic, so i go to church even though I'm not religious), they've made a switch to more literal interpretations of the Latin prayers. It's really hard to adjust to the new prayers after 15 years of the old ones!

 

Plus I don't really see much of a difference. The kind of switches they made are along the lines of-

 

"The Lord be with you."

 

"And also with you with your spirit."

 

Kinda silly if you ask me!

What! But it doesn't rhyme anymore!

 

I would keep saying the old version if it was me. Back when me old church started saying a modernized version of the Apostle's Creed, I just said the old one under my breath.

[klinneah]

The responses were changed for a reason - to be true to the original Latin text! Mass is supposed to be holy and uplifting and the new text (I think) brings back some of that wondrous awe that the words are supposed to connote. The new Creed, especially, I think is quite beautiful.

 

As an aside, my dad likes to tell stories of his mother complaining about the first change around Vatican II. ("It's not 'for all!' It's 'for many!'" And on and on and on.)

 

And if you pay careful attention, you'll notice that the priest has even more changes than you to memorize!

[prairiecrow]

11-year-old child singled out in Georgia school for being Pagan.

 

An excerpt from the article:

 

Christopher Turner, an 11 year old student from Bowden, Georgia, is your every day kid.  He plays basketball down the street with his friends, he is a straight A student, and he likes to go to church every Wed. with his friends because he finds it fun and like to socialize.  What makes a straight A student who loves school to be fearful of returning to school?? Bullying, plain and simple.

 

When bullying happens it is usually taken care of by the school, but what happens when a mother's cry for help gets no answer? What happens when the faculty at the school are the ones doing the bullying?  Nothing apparently, except for even more discrimination and harassment.

 

Towards the end of October the Turner family was getting very excited for Halloween, or for them Samhain. For them it is not just a time to get free candy and dress up for a night, but rather it is a holiday to give thanks and to remember ancenstors for the lives they lived. Samhain fell on a Monday, and like any other religious holiday, Christopher did not attend school. The next day Christopher's teacher, Mrs. Ross, pulled him out of class and proceeded to drill him about Paganism, ending the conversation with "Paganism is not a religion." Remember, this is an 11 year old student, with no parent present while being harassed about his religion by someone who is suppose to be an educator.

 

And it only gets worse from there. It's incidents like this that give Christianity a rather bad name. (I hasten to point out that not all Christians are like this, but when Christians DO act like this and other Christians don't speak up it implies approval of the discrimination and harassment. I hope that many many people, both Christian and non-Christian, hit this school right between the eyes with everything they've got.)

Edited December 6, 2011 by prairiecrow

[philpot123]

11-year-old child singled out in Georgia school for being Pagan.

 

An excerpt from the article:

 

 

 

And it only gets worse from there. It's incidents like this that give Christianity a rather bad name. (I hasten to point out that not all Christians are like this, but when Christians DO act like this and other Christians don't speak up it implies approval of the discrimination and harassment. I hope that many many people, both Christian and non-Christian, hit this school right between the eyes with everything they've got.)

What the I don't even...

 

 

 

FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU.

 

 

 

My favorite part is where she expects them to write a paper on the origins of Christmas, WITHOUT including the fact that the origins ARE pagan? WTF!? I may not agree with it (paganism), but that sure as heck ain't the way to go about winning someone to Christianity miss "you aren't allowed to be pagan in my classroom..." fail. So much fail.

 

 

Sounds like that school has multiple problems if you can be suspended for speaking Spanish.

[Kila]

11-year-old child singled out in Georgia school for being Pagan.

 

An excerpt from the article:

 

 

 

And it only gets worse from there. It's incidents like this that give Christianity a rather bad name. (I hasten to point out that not all Christians are like this, but when Christians DO act like this and other Christians don't speak up it implies approval of the discrimination and harassment. I hope that many many people, both Christian and non-Christian, hit this school right between the eyes with everything they've got.)

Mmm...

 

And that is exactly why I became an Agnostic Nondenominational.

[AngelKitty]

I hate hearing about schoolteachers harassing students. Teachers are supposed to be people you can trust, not people you fear. I've been harassed by teachers before and it makes you feel so betrayed. ._.

 

And harassing a child over something as deeply rooted and believed in as religion? Really? That teacher and the faculty who support her behavior need to be replaced, and quickly.

 

If he has to write an essay, I hope he DOES go into extreme detail about the Pagan origins of Christmas, and the Christmas tree, and the date, and the other traditional decorations, no matter what the teacher says about what he can and can't include. Sounds like the educators could use some educating themselves.

 

His mother needs to pull him out of that school and fight to get him into another one. That's what my mother did when she found out I was being harassed and singled out.

 

Edit: Sent an email to the principal and superintendent. I still hope his mother gets him out of there, though.

Edited December 6, 2011 by AngelKitty

[MellaBella]

Shouldn't discrimination like that be.. well, illegal? Especially in a school with young children. :/

 

At my old school system (in the middle of the Bible belt in Kentucky, even), there were specific rules about this kind of stuff. One that I thought was really important was "Harassment because of race, sex, religion, nationality, sexual preference, or anything else is strictly prohibited." This rule goes for everyone, student and faculty alike. The principal of the elementary school actually is currently dealing with a lawsuit because she refused to help any kids in the school who were black (and even refused to hire a person because they were black).

 

Ugh, this kind of crap frustrates me to no end.

Edited December 6, 2011 by MellaBella

[elderberrysyrup]

I would like to ask, is there something about christianity or other religions that preach the rejection of all other religions or the persecution of such? I don't much understand. As far as I know, most religions preach love, don't they? Where does persecution come into play?

[Princess Artemis]

He wouldn't have to deal with that as much in other states, probably. Several of the schools around here have quite obviously Wiccan teachers.

 

ETA: soullesshuman, some religions do have active persecution, and some denominations of some religions do also. Fred Phelps, some militant jihaadists, etc.

Edited December 6, 2011 by Princess Artemis

[potterwolf]

I would like to ask, is there something about christianity or other religions that preach the rejection of all other religions or the persecution of such? I don't much understand. As far as I know, most religions preach love, don't they? Where does persecution come into play?

People who agree and get in large groups sometimes end up persecuting the minorities that don't agree with them. Also, both Christianity and Islam preach that "unbelievers" go to hell or are evil or deserve to die, which doesn't exactly encourage tolerance.

 

It happens.

[Kila]

I would like to ask, is there something about christianity or other religions that preach the rejection of all other religions or the persecution of such? I don't much understand. As far as I know, most religions preach love, don't they? Where does persecution come into play?

A lot of the "holier than thou" aspect of Christianity comes from the fact that some Christians believe that the rules of Leviticus should be followed, which is Old Testament and, if I recall correctly, are the Jewish laws (the name of which is escaping me right now, so please forgive me), as well as other dated concepts of the Bible. Take into account the hundreds of years of translations of translations of translations (see arsenokoitai and its mistranslation) and you end up with, well, something that's taken on a completely different meaning from the original text.

 

Christians are supposed to follow Jesus' final commandment- the proverbial golden rule- "Love they neighbor as thyself."

 

That all went to hell in a handbasket during the dark ages, where the bible was literally used a propaganda. Believe in Jesus or go to Hell.

 

So while plenty Christians do preach love and tolerance, there are those who are so vehemently intolerant that they drown out the Christians who truly preach the teachings of Christ.

[JaziandCo]

11-year-old child singled out in Georgia school for being Pagan.

 

And it only gets worse from there. It's incidents like this that give Christianity a rather bad name. (I hasten to point out that not all Christians are like this, but when Christians DO act like this and other Christians don't speak up it implies approval of the discrimination and harassment. I hope that many many people, both Christian and non-Christian, hit this school right between the eyes with everything they've got.)

I'm wondering, does he go to a public or private (religious) school? What she did was not right, but if he went to a Christian school, they're allowed to do that. I went to a Mennonite school 11/12 years and things like that were common occurrences with kids who were not Christian (and kids who weren't Mennonite either). The school could actually expel you if you brought in Tarot cards, and books such as The Da Vinci Code and the entire Harry Potter series were confiscated on spot.

 

In addition, if you were found and "proved" to be gay or pregnant, you were expelled. It's legal because technically your parents have to sign a waiver allowing this to happen, but not all parents share that informations with their kids. We were also not taught about dinosaurs [they're not reaaaaaaaal!!111!!], astronomy [onoes star reading], evolution [bible was used during science class. Not kidding], or even certain historical leaders such as Malcom X [too violent, MLK was totally the only person that mattered during that time right?]. Other religions were not taught and specific pieces of history were rushed through to "not expose" us to those "awful belief systems".

 

 

 

I'm not saying I support what she did, I actually think it's vile that she would do something like that to someone and it says a lot about how she treats anyone she doesn't agree with. But if he went to a religious school, that's actually perfectly legal. Frustrating and shouldn't be legal, but it is.

[AngelKitty]

I'm wondering, does he go to a public or private (religious) school?

Nope. Did a google search for the teacher and principal and it's a public elementary school.

[Kelkelen]

People who agree and get in large groups sometimes end up persecuting the minorities that don't agree with them. Also, both Christianity and Islam preach that "unbelievers" go to hell or are evil or deserve to die, which doesn't exactly encourage tolerance.

 

It happens.

I'd be careful how you generalize those faiths. There are *extreme* sects of them which may preach those ideas. I don't know a lot of details on Islam, so I'll leave it to Muslims to explain that. But as a Christian, I've never personally met anyone of a denomination that preached that unbelievers were either evil or deserved to die. Yes, I've seen the fundamentalists on television yelling cruel things and picketing at the funerals of gay soldiers, but that is an extreme minority, and not representative of the whole -- part of the media focus on them is precisely *because* they deviate from the norm of Christian churches, and it shocks the Christian mainstream as much as it shocks people of other faiths.

 

There are some branches of Christianity which do preach that unbelievers go to hell, but that depends on the particular branch. Catholicism has such concepts as limbo and purgatory, as well as baptism by desire. Also, most relevant in this case, the Catholic church holds a belief that anyone who seeks God with a genuine desire to do what is true and good, and follow what is right, listening to their conscience, is implicitly baptized because they clearly desire to do God's will and be God's follower.

 

Also, this story is appalling, and I sincerely hope that the boy is able to transfer to a different school. How can he honestly be expected to return to that environment? Poor kid.

[potterwolf]

I'd be careful how you generalize those faiths. There are *extreme* sects of them which may preach those ideas. I don't know a lot of details on Islam, so I'll leave it to Muslims to explain that. But as a Christian, I've never personally met anyone of a denomination that preached that unbelievers were either evil or deserved to die. Yes, I've seen the fundamentalists on television yelling cruel things and picketing at the funerals of gay soldiers, but that is an extreme minority, and not representative of the whole -- part of the media focus on them is precisely *because* they deviate from the norm of Christian churches, and it shocks the Christian mainstream as much as it shocks people of other faiths.

 

There are some branches of Christianity which do preach that unbelievers go to hell, but that depends on the particular branch. Catholicism has such concepts as limbo and purgatory, as well as baptism by desire. Also, most relevant in this case, the Catholic church holds a belief that anyone who seeks God with a genuine desire to do what is true and good, and follow what is right, listening to their conscience, is implicitly baptized because they clearly desire to do God's will and be God's follower.

Yeah, that was the point of the "or's". Go to hell, OR are evil OR deserve to die.

[JaziandCo]

Yeah, that was the point of the "or's". Go to hell, OR are evil OR deserve to die.

Or neither. I don't think anyone on here deserves to go to hell/is evil/deserves to die. I'm a big promoter of good works and that if you were to truly believe a certain way and still be a good person (as is the majority), then if there truly is a heaven, that's where you'll go. On the flip side, I also believe that evil people can exist in all religions including my own.

 

Try not to generalize. Not all of us are Bible-thumping fundies out to make you miserable or feel terrible about yourself.

[Keriel]

A story my dad told me. he came from a christian family attended church every sunday.

first year of school his grade 1 teacher a die hard christian started explaining how God HAD to of created everything by using a black board duster. for the black board duster to come into existance, someone HAD to make it, this is proof that some/one/thing had to of made the earth.

Remember my dad was only six at this stage. he raises his hand and asks quite sincerely "Then who made god?" he was caned and suspended from school for that. he was a christian, but that was the day he started turning atheist.

 

Sadly to this day, this still happens

[philpot123]

Or neither. I don't think anyone on here deserves to go to hell/is evil/deserves to die. I'm a big promoter of good works and that if you were to truly believe a certain way and still be a good person (as is the majority), then if there truly is a heaven, that's where you'll go. On the flip side, I also believe that evil people can exist in all religions including my own.

 

Try not to generalize. Not all of us are Bible-thumping fundies out to make you miserable or feel terrible about yourself.

But... But I'm a bible thumping fundie...

[JaziandCo]

But... But I'm a bible thumping fundie...

*whaps philpot with a Bible* =V

 

Har har, Bible thumping, get it? ;3

[Princess Artemis]

Yeah, that was the point of the "or's". Go to hell, OR are evil OR deserve to die.

Or there isn't a hell the way people see in paintings and Chick tracts. Or, y'know, generalizing about two very large religions. You need more "ors" in there to cover the beliefs of hundreds of millions of followers of both.

[_Z_]

Topic reminder:

Please take the chat to pm.

 

 

Thank you.

Edited December 7, 2011 by _Z_

[Kelkelen]

Yeah, that was the point of the "or's". Go to hell, OR are evil OR deserve to die.

Yes, but you stated that Christianity (not 'some branches of Christianity') preaches that unbelievers do one of the three, which is a statement about the whole umbrella religion, not individual sects. That isn't true -- only certain sects preach the first, and I would say that none but the most extreme fundamentalist groups preach the latter two.