Sexism

[Kestra15]

So true It's the biggest male dilemma, I think.

Boobs, always.

 

But their positioning does mean that you can look at one and still hold the other.

[CrossingStar]

Boobs, always.

 

But their positioning does mean that you can look at one and still hold the other.

I'm so proud

[zorua9]

I can't look at a girl because i don't wanna be called a pervert -.-||

[KageSora]

I can't look at a girl because i don't wanna be called a pervert -.-||

You can look at girls without being a pervert.

 

You just can't stare at their chests, butts, or crotches. Because that's rude. Unless you know them and they don't care. Because some girls don't care, and stuff.

 

But it's also rude for girls to stare at guys.

 

Looking at somebody and glancing at certain parts of their body is not the same thing as openly staring.

[Kestra15]

I'm the class nerd, the freak, the person who does her homework and does it well because it's the only damn chance I get to better my life. People look at me weird for not being pretty, for being white, for being a girl. All I see is stupidity and wasted talent.

Nerds rock my world. Always. I end up hanging around with the 'less attractive' girls who do their homework and prefer a quiet night in playing on the Wii and watching sci-fi shows and playing cards in the pub, than the 'pretty' girls with the duck-faces and boob-tubes and metric ton of make-up. And frankly, once you take the fake tan and fifteen inches of foundation off their faces, the 'pretty' ones are usually hideous. And I am a great believer in the cliche that it's what's on the inside that makes a person beautiful, and that is what I see.

 

(I just got lucky that Amerylis is not only a nerd, but attractive to boot - I will always maintain I am punching well above my weight with her!)

 

Having said that, if the 18yr olds want to wear next to nothing on a night out I will oblige and stare ;~) Just have to make sure Amerylis doesn't catch me too many times!

Edited December 6, 2012 by Kestra15

[St. Jimmy]

Having said that, if the 18yr olds want to wear next to nothing on a night out I will oblige and stare ;~)

I think they'd appreciate it if you kept your eyes to yourself.

[Kestra15]

I think they'd appreciate it if you kept your eyes to yourself.

In all seriousness, I never understand why women go to the club in literally their underwear, then complain that people look at them - if you're going to wear clothing that reveals every inch of your body, then expect people to stop and stare! If you don't want people to look, then cover up. I just don't understand this weird state of play to be honest.

 

I'm not saying they have to wrap themselves up in parkas and sallopetes, but honestly, if you're wearing nothing but a bra and a skirt that is so short it shows your g-string, how can you then stand there and argue that no-one should 'objectify' you when you have already objectified yourself? There are plenty of sensible clothes you can wear that make you look a heck of a lot more attractive *and* keep your modesty.

[Zaxian]

In all seriousness, I never understand why women go to the club in literally their underwear, then complain that people look at them - if you're going to wear clothing that reveals every inch of your body, then expect people to stop and stare! If you don't want people to look, then cover up. I just don't understand this weird state of play to be honest.

 

I'm not saying they have to wrap themselves up in parkas and sallopetes, but honestly, if you're wearing nothing but a bra and a skirt that is so short it shows your g-string, how can you then stand there and argue that no-one should 'objectify' you when you have already objectified yourself? There are plenty of sensible clothes you can wear that make you look a heck of a lot more attractive *and* keep your modesty.

People (men or women) can *look* if they want. What I (and I'm sure others) object to is staring and *leering*, both of which are unpleasant and rude regardless of your gender or what you're wearing.

 

I would like to clarify that it's a fairly rare event that I go clubbing actually wearing a cleavage (ha!) revealing top and a short skirt - and when I do go out clubbing wearing a top and trousers, there's a noticeable reduction in male attention. So your assertion that there are 'plenty of sensible clothes you can wear to make you look a heck of a lot more attractive' might be true for you but I'm not at all convinced that it's the norm. (And tbh, you've contradicted it a bit by suggesting that you're quite happy to 'stare at 18yr olds wearing next to nothing' rather than your presumably more 'sensibly' dressed girlfriend).

[St. Jimmy]

if you're going to wear clothing that reveals every inch of your body, then expect people to stop and stare! If you don't want people to look, then cover up.

How about instead of telling them to expect people to stare, you (general you) stop staring at them? I'm sure guys have more self control than that.

 

if you're wearing nothing but a bra and a skirt that is so short it shows your g-string, how can you then stand there and argue that no-one should 'objectify' you when you have already objectified yourself?

They (usually) don't dress that way to objectify themselves. It makes them feel confident about their bodies. After centuries of being told what to wear by men, it's great that women finally get a chance to wear as much or as little clothing as they want.

 

There are plenty of sensible clothes you can wear that make you look a heck of a lot more attractive *and* keep your modesty.

Maybe they're more attractive to you, but they're not dressing for your approval. Don't think it makes them look attractive? Then look away.

Edited December 7, 2012 by St. Jimmy

[Slaskia]

Remember the article by that one lady that said us women need to get back in touch with our 'feminine side'? Well, she wrote a response article to all the negative feedback she's been getting.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/12/07/...-in-war-on-men/

 

Somehow...I find the response more offensive than the first article...

 

Course it doesn't help that I seem to be more male than female if you go by her gender descriptors....

Edited December 7, 2012 by Slaskia

[TikindiDragon]

They (usually) don't dress that way to objectify themselves. It makes them feel confident about their bodies. After centuries of being told what to wear by men, it's great that women finally get a chance to wear as much or as little clothing as they want.

Hmmmmm.... I'd actually debate that point with you. While there may be a number of confident people with a feminist ethos that *do* dress in such a way to 'empower' themselves the vast majority of girls I've known dress the way they do because they want male attention. Just because there are people out there that have changed their own views, and would like to chage the views of others, doesn't mean that the masses aren't actually still reacting to their societal conditioning.

[Syaoransbear]

Women objectify themselves. I don't understand how they expect to gain male respect and be treated as an equal member of the human specie when they continually prove and encourage the idea that the most and often only important feature of a woman is her appearance and sexual desirability.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Syaoransbear

[St. Jimmy]

Ever consider that maybe they just like dressing that way for the hell of it?

[WereJace]

Yeah, a lot of my friends are women who wear clothes that don't cover much or are very tight or are short or flashy or what have you, and they're definitely doing it because they like those clothes, not because they want men to pay attention to them. What a woman wears dictates exactly nothing about her intelligence or what kind of person she is.

[Syaoransbear]

Ever consider that maybe they just like dressing that way for the hell of it?

Yeah, because thongs and very constricting, skimpy clothing in -30C weather is just really enjoyable and comfortable to wear. I don't see them wearing that stuff around the house. I know they dress that way for male attention, I'm 23 and female so I'm in the demographic that frequents clubs and dresses provocatively, so I know many sources that will admit their intentions. Maybe that's not how it is in other places, but that's how it is here. Drinking and going to bars is pretty much the only thing people do around here(because it pretty much IS the only thing to do around here), and sex goes along with that.

 

EDIT: And I like to think that women aren't that stupid to not realize they are objectifying themselves when they dress that way. It makes a lot more sense to purposefully dress that way to gain the benefit of male attention to boost their self esteems, get free drinks, and maybe get a chance to take someone home then for them to actually believe they aren't going to be viewed as sex objects by dressing that way.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Syaoransbear

[kiffren]

Remember the article by that one lady that said us women need to get back in touch with our 'feminine side'? Well, she wrote a response article to all the negative feedback she's been getting.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/12/07/...-in-war-on-men/

 

Somehow...I find the response more offensive than the first article...

 

Course it doesn't help that I seem to be more male than female if you go by her gender descriptors....

-cringes- I'm sorry but, I don't even know. Is she serious? I guess it is on foxnews.

[WereJace]

Or they're actually comfortable in those clothes, like how they look, and want to wear what they like to go have fun with their friends. And the people in that clothing deserve to not be harrassed and abused because their skirt is short, their heels are tall, their neckline is diving, whatever. It's not stupid to expect that men will behave like decent human beings no matter how much skin a woman is exposing.

[Shienvien]

I don't see them wearing that stuff around the house.

I do wear kind of skimpy clothing around the house during summer when it's 30-35 C outside. Sitting in front of the computer in bikini and dripping (I have a pond in my back yard) is also nothing out of ordinary during that time. I simply feel comfortable feeling little clothes if it is that warm out, that's all.

- I know plenty of people who are the same way.

 

ETA: To that article ... I feel little need to 'take care of' someone. I am poorly equipped when the nurturing is concerned. However, I am the kind of person who will without hesitation go (and did once actually go!) into knife-fight barehanded because a half-stranger's life is in danger. I do not talk unless I have something interesting to say and/or the topic is interesting. I love constructing things, either in reality or on schemes.

...I wonder what am I?

Edited December 7, 2012 by Shienvien

[St. Jimmy]

I do wear kind of skimpy clothing around the house during summer when it's 30-35 C outside. Sitting in front of the computer in bikini and dripping (I have a pond in my back yard) is also nothing out of ordinary during that time. I simply feel comfortable feeling little clothes if it is that warm out, that's all.

- I know plenty of people who are the same way.

This. So much this.

 

Adding to that... I'm a cosplayer. I've worn a few skimpy outfits to cons before, not because I want guys to look at me, but because I love the character designs. And right now, one of my OC's outfits that I'm working on is quite revealing and I plan on wearing that to a con someday. Again, only because I love the design. So, who's to say that the same thought process can't happen with regular clothes?

 

Yes, I know there are some women who wear revealing clothes to get attention from men, and who knows, it might be the majority in some places. I'm just trying to point out it's not always like that.

[Rewolluzza]

ETA: To that article ... I feel little need to 'take care of' someone. I am poorly equipped when the nurturing is concerned. However, I am the kind of person who will without hesitation go (and did once actually go!) into knife-fight barehanded because a half-stranger's life is in danger. I do not talk unless I have something interesting to say and/or the topic is interesting. I love constructing things, either in reality or on schemes.

...I wonder what am I?

That's simple. You're one of the (few) exceptions to the natural way women and men are. I'm one, too. As are 95% of my friends of both sexes. But that clearly has to be coincidence, since that nice lady obviously knows exactly how "normal" people feel...

Ack!

Articles like this make me want to scream really unnurturing things at my computer screen...

[Alpha1]

ETA: To that article ... I feel little need to 'take care of' someone. I am poorly equipped when the nurturing is concerned.

 

Yet you feel a need to take care of a dragon.

[Walker]

Yet you feel a need to take care of a dragon.

... Whut? I don't see your point at all. DC is a computer game and doesn't reflect gender at all. That's like saying people play SIMs because they're chicks and like to nurture virtual humans. Yet, plenty of guys play SIMs. And girls. There's no connection.

[TikindiDragon]

Yes, I know there are some women who wear revealing clothes to get attention from men, and who knows, it might be the majority in some places. I'm just trying to point out it's not always like that.

It's certainly been like that with most, if not all, of the women I've known. (Just reminding you all here that I am female bodied. I don't like to aknowledge it, but... I went through my late-teenage 'clubbing' years without even knowing what trans *was*. So, no, my opinion isn't formed as someone that's never experienced any of it. I've had female friends, that talked to me as a girl... and male reaction *was* what they were talking about when they got ready to go out).

 

Plus, really, when it's below freezing no one in their right mind wears *that* little clothing to be comfortable. Middle of summer is one thing, middle of a British winter quite another.

[Alpha1]

... Whut? I don't see your point at all. DC is a computer game and doesn't reflect gender at all. That's like saying people play SIMs because they're chicks and like to nurture virtual humans. Yet, plenty of guys play SIMs. And girls. There's no connection.

I don't know what the ratio is for Sim games, but that's not the only factor. I wonder who is more likely to play raising a family and who wants to trash the place.

 

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=...umer&id=7196100

 

"Historically games have really been a lot about shoot 'em up, sports, these very aggressive activities. They're very competitive," said Lisa Leyba, the Senior Product Manager at Electronic Arts. "Girls really need something different in the games they're looking for."

 

Game developers like Leyba say game companies are, for the first time, looking at the needs and wants of female players of all ages.

 

"We actually play test with thousands and thousands of girls. And the things they want are dress up, they want to go on scavenger hunts, they want to have nurturing games," said Leyba

 

Last year alone, the gaming industry grossed $700 million in software for girls. Companies introduced games like "The Littlest Pet Shop" where players take care of their own digital pet and fashion games for teens like "Charm Girls Club." Workout games like "Wii Fit" have also been hugely popular for women."

[Shienvien]

Yet you feel a need to take care of a dragon.

I simply like collecting shiny things, that's all. That has no connection to the desire to nurture at all.

(If nurturing any actual living thing only were as easy as putting a link up on two sites after first obtaining it! Or, for the matter of fact, not only living beings, but most more complex devices or pieces of equipment in existence... Bicycles require far more 'nurture' than that, let along cars or computers ... plenty of cars are quite 'well-nurtured', including those with male owners, heh.)

 

 

I also tried playing Sims for a bit, though I must admit the main interesting aspect was building the house. Not dressing the sims up, not making them do stuff, but just ... constructing a structure and the adjacent garden - and that was the same for all other females I know played the game (excluding the cases when The Sadist of the Virtual surfaced and they tested, for instance, how long would the sims stay alive if they didn't make a click...). I haven't installed the game on any of my present computers.

- I usually pay first-person-shooters (beginning from Unreal back in the end of nineties), real-time-strategy (beginning from the first Command&Conquer) any rally (first something called Death Rally, then the Need for Speed series). I'd probably play RPGs more often, too, but ones with what I term decent mechanics are fairly rare.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Shienvien