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Sexism

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I don't see many recent cartoons, but the less recent ones mostly had useless parents and an annoying pain in the butt sister. I do remember one of my favorite cartoons, The Real Ghostbusters, took a serious down-turn in quality when the network decreed that the female character in it needed to be a good role model and more motherly. Gaaaaah. I still cringe over what they did to her.

 

Your point about how hyper/hyposensitive people can have valid points really adds up to "ad hominem is a logical fallacy" which is a point that needs to be made sometimes! Thank you for making it in a different way.

 

Zovesta, the women who told you that you were dragging them down for having 'old fashioned' preferences were stupid : (

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I'm honestly surprised that my post wasn't passed over in the heat of the debate. Thank you guys for taking the time to read it, I know it was a monster to get through. ^^ (Also, thanks for the censor warning, Sock. I'm sorry, I was raised by man-hating sailors, swear words sound more familiar to me than do words like "afternoon" and "calculus")

 

Also, I am glad you guys think that I'm not setting back women a million years because of my own preferences. v__v I don't talk to a lot of people about my tastes for fear of that.

 

Yes, Princess Artemis, that's exactly what I mean. Why do they even think that they need to do that? =/ I'll be honest, I find that so much more insulting than boobs-and-butt poses in superhero comics. At least that can be laughed off as being completely ridiculous.

 

@SockPuppet Strangler:

Here are some off the top of my head:

Fairly Odd Parents - Originally started out as being pretty good in regards to this. The mom and the dad were equally silly, as were Cosmo and Wanda (though Wanda was always slightly more mature, it didn't bother me). After awhile, the mom became an annoying "moms have super powers" kind of stereotype, and Wanda became a nagging harpy. She was also the only semi-intelligent character on the show. All the males pretty much became brain dead.

 

Dan Vs. - This one I'm not so bothered by, since Chris is pretty much as boring as his wife, Elise, but while Chris is kind of an entertaining victim (and Dan a completely funny character), his wife is smart, sensible, powerful, and apparently the most skilled person on the planet. >_> I haven't seen the show in a bit, but I kinda really hope it was a joke.

 

Futurama - Leeeelaaaaa. That's pretty much all I need to say. Actually, let me just quote myself from a bit ago. "In Futurama, we have the lazy, stupid guy that got frozen, woke up a thousand years later, etc. We have the kleptomaniac, who is a murdering, loud-mouthed, overly-emotional (at times), robot. We have a mad scientist with a memory problem. The hideous, put-upon hobo. The list goes on. Our main female character? A one-eyed mutant. Sounds like we're starting with a good, interesting female character, but she ends up having the typical mothering personality, being extremely tough, and being the only sensible one in the show. "

 

Jimmy Two-Shoes - While it does have a somewhat entertaining female character, Heloise, as she's a beautifully creepy stalker, she ends up being such a boring, overpowered censorkip.gif* archetype her good traits end up being overlooked most of the time.

 

Spongebob Squarepants - Actually, part of the reason why I like this show is because they managed to avoid it so amazingly with Mrs. Puff. The world needs more female characters like Mrs. Puff in cartoons. However, they have Sandy Cheeks, who is pretty much the mother type character taken to the extreme. Instead of making her character based off of the sheer weirdness of a squirrel living underwater, they also made her insanely intelligent and a daredevil, so it ended up becoming blah.

 

Avatar: the Last Airbender - so how long until I get killed for bringing this show up in a negative light. -shot- Anyway, though, while it does score some brownie points from me for having Toph, she often reminds me just a bit too much of the censorkip.gif* archetype I mentioned before. Oh, and Katara's the mom of the group. To the extreme. Suki doesn't have that much personality. She often just made me think of "Katara lite" half the time, I swear.

 

Those are quite literally the first examples that came to mind in about fifteen seconds. I actually could go on. =/

 

 

Also, yes. I've seen that ad before. That is just... horrifying. It was have just been eyeroll worthy if he was hitting on her, or she was magnetized by his amazing taste in alcohol, but that was just plain terrifying. That is the look of a woman scared for her life. The idea that anyone thought that was even remotely acceptable is baffling.

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The messages I read from people who talk about this kind of thing (keep in mind I am just going to certain sites, so this is a biased view that I am talking about) are really about an understanding of these two. Going with the hypersensitive/hyposensitive terminology since I dun have anything better... If a hyposensitive person says that something offends them, take the time to realize it offends them, apologize, perhaps think about why it offended them, and move on. If a hypersensitive person says something that offends you, realize how they meant it, perhaps make a comment about how not everyone may find that appropriate, and move on. In the most basic circumstances, anyway.

I think the only problem a lot of hypo-sensitive people (like myself), and even some mid-range people have when talking to the hyper-sensitive ones is that there seems to be an expectation that bahvious and attitudes need to change all the time, and throughout society at large. To me it seems perfectly reasonable to simply not 'push peoples buttons', as it were, and avoid doing/mentioning things around them that I know are going to offend. The impression I've got from some hyper- people is that I need to be doing it even when they're not around, and that society itself needs to have an intrinsic change to it.

 

Now, forgive me here, but it's much easier to change a person than it is to change society. It took me a long time to work this out, but... In the long run you, as a person, will be happier if you can come to terms with who you are and the way you relate to the world we live in. Because the world at large isn't going to change things it doesn't see as being a problem just because they are upsetting *you*.

 

That's not to say that the world *can't* be changed, and doing things like refusing to buy/support certain products is really the way to do it. Saying "Would you mind not saying that around me, it really bothers me." is the way to do it. But if you want to be happy in yourself - then you've got to learn to let a certain amount of it slide off you like water off a ducks back. Because there's not a single person that the world is perfect for, and it's certainly impossible to make it perfect for everyone. Which means you have to learn to take the rough with the smooth, and focus on the small things rather than expecting the basis of society to change.

 

Note: The 'you' used throught this post is the generic, not the personal. And God I wish we had a way in English to differentiate between the two. The use of 'one' for 'generic you' has so completely fallen out of use it might as well be archaic.

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When I see cartoons, it's pretty much always all the women in it have perfect bodies and their personalities are smart, sometimes talented, but also nagging ruin-your-fun types. And the men are fat and/or stupid. What I'm getting is that the media is saying the best a smart, perfect looking woman can do is the bottom of the barrel for men. These fat, dumb guys ARE role models for men. They are role models to UNDERACHIEVE. I'm pretty sure men like watching these shows because they like to think that no matter how poorly they do in life, how out of shape they get, how detestable their personalities are, they can still get the hot trophy wife/girl.

 

I think they do this because they are afraid to make a female seem stupid or inferior to a man. But really they are just setting ridiculously high standards when a stupid, overweight female character doesn't even exist anywhere in the media. We can't all be the smart, independent mother/wife who has the body of a teenager/model.

 

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*edited because I somehow forgot family guy tongue.gif

 

I don't think these cartoons are saying that males are fat and stupid. I think it's saying that it's okay for men to be fat and stupid, while it's absolutely not okay for women to be that way.

 

I think the only exception is king of the hill. Peggy Hill had an awesome body and hank doesn't, but Peggy is quite stupid. Too bad it was cancelled in favor of the cleveland show, ugh.

Edited by Syaoransbear

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^You forgot family guy!

 

Seriously I hate both Lois and Peter Griffin. The only reason I still watch that show is because of Stewie.

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^You forgot family guy!

 

Seriously I hate both Lois and Peter Griffin. The only reason I still watch that show is because of Stewie.

Thanks! I even had it uploaded onto my photobucket but I forgot to copy it on there tongue.gif.

 

I liked stewie a lot when he was intelligent and trying to murder his mother or take over the world. Now his personality is just having some sort of gender/sexual crisis all the time.

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Thanks! I even had it uploaded onto my photobucket but I forgot to copy it on there tongue.gif.

 

I liked stewie a lot when he was intelligent and trying to murder his mother or take over the world. Now his personality is just having some sort of gender/sexual crisis all the time.

Agreed. But Stewie is still one of the more original characters I've seen for a long time, and he still has that sort of evil malevolent streak that shows up sometimes...which makes up for the rest.

 

To add on about that show, I really loathe how they treat Meg...

 

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I don't like the show period. And Stewie is my least favourite part of it, so.

 

But, yeah, very good point there. It's really, really annoying, and very offensive. =/

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I don't think these cartoons are saying that males are fat and stupid. I think it's saying that it's okay for men to be fat and stupid, while it's absolutely not okay for women to be that way.

^this^

 

EXACTLY !

 

Fuzzy said I claimed there is oversensitivity going on in here, and I did, not only by girls here but also guys, hospitals make pink clothes for girls, seriously thats so offensive ? guy opens up a door for you and you see it as some horrible act  blink.gif wonder woman's hip doesnt look realistic in a comic book  blink.gif its a comic book for crying out loud, wonder woman beats the living crap out of thousands of guys, she's the definition of a strong independent woman and yet people in here will find something sexist there too, so yup, oversensitivity is about right...

I'm not so sure. Because most of these things (even the pink - there is a big article about that and the effect it has somewhere which I will try to find) suggest that women are LESS than men, and you rarely get that the other way around. YES, I concede Wonderwoman and also Geraldine Grainger. And Sarah Lund actually biggrin.gif

 

But tell me ED (can I call you that, sweety ???) - when did sexism last directly affect you ? When - at work, say - were you told that you could not go and see a senior officer because you were wearing - whatever you were wearing ? (In my case and on several occasions, GOOD, classy pants. In the case of a mate, a REALLY good pantsuit from Hermes...) When - again at work - were you told to get the coffee for a load of people at a meeting, all but one of whom was well junior to you, because you were the woman.

When was the last time a doctor didn't take you seriously because you were a woman, and the next person in with exactly the same complaint got a fully comprehensive examination - because HE was a GUY. (I can document this on a few doctors, but I haven't the consent of the people involved; it comes from a case where the doctor refused to believe someone - a MOTHER - that her son was not OK - he actually had NO HGH and if the FATHER had not in the end gone in he would never have made it to the 4 foot 6 he now is. The father - once the injections started went back and complained - and the doctor said "Well, women just fuss - I couldn't see there was a problem.") This is NOT an isolated case, or a single doctor. And I can't COUNT the number of doctors I have known of (I used to work in this stuff) who tell women "It's your time of the month," or, later, "it's your time of life." I don't entirely blame them - they learn this from our sexist society. And I do know that most doctors are NOT like that - but it is NOT something you will get from a female doctor, I think. It IS getting better - but it is all part of the same thing that does lead to the rape camps and so on.

 

It is the kind of thing that is so very invidious and which goes on ALL THE TIME. The bimboising of women is all a part of it - the belittling, the women are slaves thing.

 

The small things may seem small to you - but when you are being told to make the coffee every day for lazy men, and the same little twerp who demanded coffee then opens the doors for you.... Ugh. (For the record, I carried on with the pants, and I refused to make the coffee. But most women aren't as vile as I am biggrin.gif)

 

regarding "because you are secretly thrilled to see anti-male sexism" she has claimed otherwise, I was speaking of things as I see them here, I choose to believe her saying otherwise, Fuzzy, I apologize for that remark, was off mark, wasn't cool of me, cant take it back so I apologize....

Thank you. Cos I have NEVER really enjoyed ogling men - I cannot see the POINT of the Chippendales.... xd.png and as for "Wow look at that butt" - well, - it's a butt. Who cares. blink.gif

 

Except faces. Alan Rickman.... Hmmmm.

Edited by fuzzbucket

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I don't really see the whole debate about overweight women as sexism. Honestly, there is a huge majority of women who wouldn't want a fat man. There's also a huge majority of men who wouldn't want a fat woman. The only difference is men who want nice looking women are more noticable.

 

I admit that I have standards when it comes to a future wife.

 

I would never date someone I couldn't be physically attracted to. I wouldn't want to have to lie to her about being pretty/beautiful if I didn't believe it.

 

I'm not saying women HAVE to have a size 0 waist, but they still shouldn't be at an unhealthy weight. I'm sure if they really wanted to lose weight, they could do it. I hate the "fat is beautiful" phrase. IMO, it's an excuse to be fat and lazy and weigh well over 250 lbs.

Edited by predatorfan4ever

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@predatorfan4ever: Ouch. And I thought you had won me over on your stand when it came to gay marriage. ;(

 

We were mainly referring to cartoons, and how that is a recurring theme.

 

What about people who aren't fat through their own choice? They do exist, you know. =U And who's to say that fat people who are fat because of their own choices can't get their love on? And that people who are a healthy weight can't find them attractive?

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What about people who aren't fat through their own choice? They do exist, you know. =U And who's to say that fat people who are fat because of their own choices can't get their love on? And that people who are a healthy weight can't find them attractive?

^This

 

Mostly, I don't think that fat people should be commented on. Their bodies should not be the pubic property of the masses to comment on. If they feel okay with being fat, well then, good for them. Look at Adele-she's a bit on the chubby side, but if she feels okay about it, then I don't see why I should say anything about her body towards her.

 

ETA: I will only comment about other people's body if they're specifically asking me to judge them. Example-"Does this dress look fat on me?"

Edited by ylangylang

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Now, forgive me here, but it's much easier to change a person than it is to change society. It took me a long time to work this out, but... In the long run you, as a person, will be happier if you can come to terms with who you are and the way you relate to the world we live in. Because the world at large isn't going to change things it doesn't see as being a problem just because they are upsetting *you*.

This is why I, as one who likely could be labeled one of the 'hypersensitive' ones, try to get only people to change. The more people that change, the more society will. I don't wish to do that by force in any way. I want it done by choice. Do you think society is something that is not made up of people?

 

Do you think society has set aside some fantastically offensive behaviors as socially unacceptable now because the persons affected by them shut up about them, resigned to the fact that society would never change? Or...did they go do something about it and end up changing the minds of the people that make society run?

 

This is all wrapped up in my religious view of life. The hatred of women is ingrained in humanity and it won't go away until humanity is redeemed, but I sure do think there are ways to alleviate the frequency and violence of its expression. One of those ways is to let people have a chance to see what I see. They can't have that if I resign myself to the myth of the never-changing society.

 

ETA:

There's also a huge majority of men who wouldn't want a fat woman.

 

Good thing women don't exist for the sole pleasure of men then, isn't it?

Edited by Princess Artemis

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I don't see how we could say the world doesn't change though. Though I do think things like pink clothes are more stereotypical than sexist. Color choice in clothing seems to be determined more by what group one identifies with. IE, preppy, head-bangers, ropers, wavers, geeks, jocks etc. Plenty of preppy jocks wear pastel colors but I wouldn't expect that from goths.

 

Back to the change thing, I think we may underestimate how long it takes for any given position to change. Take prohibition. There's still a large number of states where it's prohibited to sell hard drink in certain counties. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_county

 

I've seen it repeated a lot that many of the current negative ideals about women stem from the Victorian era, but I've not seen a thesis backing up how. But certainly in the states, the road to women's rights was not easy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_Sentinels

It's depressing to see people like Rush Limbaugh use terms like femi-nazi. For how many groups, would it be acceptable to constantly use the term nazi to describe them? Yet, people use the word feminist as a curse. And this year, we see more cuts/challenges to battered women's shelters, women's health, the national Violence against Women act. There's certainly remnants of the same attitudes that jailed and beat those women in 1917 for daring to want the right to vote.

 

Feels like we have several tangents though. Annoying cliches that spread into clothing etc, true issues such as fair pay and whether society is fair to men who experience sexism.

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I'm not saying women HAVE to have a size 0 waist, but they still shouldn't be at an unhealthy weight. I'm sure if they really wanted to lose weight, they could do it. I hate the "fat is beautiful" phrase. IMO, it's an excuse to be fat and lazy and weigh well over 250 lbs.

The problem there is that "healthy weight" cannot be standardized and applied to the masses. This is why people dislike the Body Mass Index (BMI) because it attempts to standardize "healthy weight" based on height and age when there are a lot more factors that play a part in "healthy weight," like the size and weight of the underlying skeleton. So what exactly is an "unhealthy weight," then?

 

I don't think the phrase is an excuse; rather, a self-esteem booster for those women who can't drop the weight for whatever reason. In fact, have you ever heard of hypothyroidism? I have it. So does my mom. It's a disorder where the thyroid produces too little thyroid hormone, inducing a slow metabolism and can cause a slew of other issues down the road if it goes undiagnosed and untreated, including heart disease. A common symptom is weight gain that's EXTREMELY difficult to lose. I am fat (around 30-40lbs overweight), AND I am beautiful.

 

===

 

I find sexism goes both ways. It's just harder to see it against men than it is against women.

 

And Family Guy - oh lord. <.< Stewie and Brian are about the only characters I like on that show.... I hate the way all those cartoons have women portrayed as fun-ruiners and men as idiots. :I

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Honestly, there is a huge majority of women who wouldn't want a fat man. There's also a huge majority of men who wouldn't want a fat woman. The only difference is men who want nice looking women are more noticable.

Women are less obsessed with weight and looks than men are.

 

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/...ut-their-looks/ As a note, there's a couple of crude (and definitely sexist, in BOTH directions) remarks in this article but nothing too explicit. This is the important part anyway:

 

"Yet look around you and you’ll see much more than 20% of men either hooking up or in relationships of varying strength with women. How can this be if women think 80% of men are ugly? Well, it can only be if women don’t put as much emphasis on men’s looks."

 

"Women are messaging less attractive men (according to women’s own assessments) because the suite of male attractiveness traits that women viscerally respond to includes much more than male physical attractiveness.

 

Women are looking at and judging the ENTIRE PROFILE of men on OkCupid and sending messages based on a more holistic appreciation of attractive male qualities. And what we can see based on female message sent rates is that plenty of ugly men — as perceived by women — are bringing other, compensating, attractiveness characteristics to the table that women find desirable in a mate."

 

I admit that I have standards when it comes to a future wife.

 

So people who are okay with a partner being overweight just don't have high enough standards. Good to know.

 

I'm not saying women HAVE to have a size 0 waist, but they still shouldn't be at an unhealthy weight. I'm sure if they really wanted to lose weight, they could do it. I hate the "fat is beautiful" phrase. IMO, it's an excuse to be fat and lazy and weigh well over 250 lbs.

 

Because all fat people are hideous and ugly, am I right? It's totally impossible to be fat and beautiful. And all those ugly fatties can't possibly be happy with their body the way it is, am I right? No, they're just making excuses so they can be fat and lazy.

 

Congratulations, that bit of bigotry just made me ill.

Edited by AngelKitty

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Eh, I know females get a lot of rag on. As a female (in body, not in mind), my mother tells me I'll never be successful because I'm fat. The first thing she's ever said to me when I haven't seen her in 6 mo (college) is 'wow, you're still so fat'. She grabs my ass and tells me 'wow, your butt got big, you need to lose weight or you'll never get anywhere in life'. Some guys seem appalled by the behavior when I tell them, except every girl I know seems to know someone like that. Unfortunately, it's also the guys who insist on this behavior. In fact, I have a bit of a hunch that one of the reasons I have such an aversity to my own sex is because of all the negative stuff I'm forced to associate with it (I'm fat, I'm not pretty, I'm not girly, I'm not social, I don't take care of my hair and makeup, I don't like shopping for clothes, etc) because of my sex I'm judged in all these ways that guys simply don't have. As a person who dances both lanes of male and female, a guy's sexism and a girl's sexism are entirely different.

 

For a guy, it's not really your looks, it's what you do. It's how you act. Liking the artsy? You're not masculine enough. Unless you manage to be funny and witty, there's no real excuse to not be manly like one of the guys. A lot of guys judge each other not on appearance but on actions. Not having a job, not having a girlfriend, not taking control of the relationship, being okay with telling another guy know he looks hot while not being gay, etc. You don't have to be the hot, sexy, shirtless man. There's no pressure to. This is totally different for a girl.

 

As a girl, there is pressure from everyone to look a certain way. It's the most annoying censorkip.gif I've ever had to deal with, honestly. There is almost nothing about being a guy that compares to how much bull is associated with appearances and chicks.

Edited by soullesshuman

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I'm a bit neutral since I've seen both sides of the issue. I'm a woman who was a Marine for five years. I went to Afghanistan twice. My guys respected me. I wasn't the strongest, but I didn't shy away from work and did my darnedest to get equal treatment. Didn't always happen since some guys are just caught up in the mindset that they need to help women, but I tried to prevent that as much as possible. They were also the types who seemed to think that it was nigh on treason to let a female live, even in the field, without a physical quarters and set aside sanitation resource buildings. Drove me nuts. I also never shied away from raunchy and inappropriate humor. It oddly works as a bonding ritual in the military. It's completely politically incorrect, but everyone in your shop is fair game and gets it equally. I also never got offended or complained about it, and I think they appreciated that.

 

There were plenty of women like me that I served with, but there were also our polar opposites. Definitely didn't correspond to size or femininity, either. Some women would use their sex appeal to get unequal treatment, would try to get out of living in the dirt on ops with the guys, got offended at every little thing (and were often the most vocal about sexism ironically enough), and seemed to be of the opinion that they weren't obligated to do any real physical exertion due to their gender. They also tended to be the types who slept around, and then got offended at the inevitable results. It isn't fair since guys get kudos for similar behavior, but I think the difference is many of these women would do this within the unit and/or barracks which is a nightmare for the workplace.

 

So I've seen both sides. What I get irritated at is the politicization of the issue, often by representatives of both sides who have no concept of the underlying issue whatever the slant. Or those who champion the ludicrous statistic that 1 in 3 women get raped in the military, and that somehow most of these get covered up in some magical legal/medical/news triad that would put CIA and MI6 to shame.

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Everything has already been said for me, so thanks to anyone who answered my question/replied to me/said what I was going to. <3

 

Tikindi - yuppers, I agree. If I happen to mention to something that I find something they've said offensive, I'm not expecting them to pass that along to the next person. I'm not even expecting them to stop saying it completely. Just hoping that they'll at least understand and try not to say it around me. If from there, they begin to say it less or ask others to stop, that's great, but I know I can't force anything on anyone. :3

 

and the doctor said "Well, women just fuss - I couldn't see there was a problem."

 

This is kind of hilarious because in my life experience, in general, men are more likely to get worked up over children being hurt or sick than women are. Some of us may be nicer about thinking someone is just being a baby, but that doesn't mean that we're going to rush them to the doctor. x3

 

^ Not saying that's true, just a general pattern I've noticed in my life.

(There seems to be a point when me and all the girls and women I knew grew out of band-aids. The men I know, if they get a paper cut, go running to the neosporin and stick a band-aid on it. A kid gets hurt, the women will spend a second glancing it over and deem they're probably okay, just shocked, and move on. The men come rushing in offering dozens of tubes of neosporin and bad-aids, lol. Once when I got hurt when I was younger, my mom had to force my dad and his friend to not encourage me because I was fine, but they were making a big deal out of it. Although, I could probably also mention a pattern here that they're more likely to do this for girls than boys.)

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Everything has already been said for me, so thanks to anyone who answered my question/replied to me/said what I was going to. <3

 

Tikindi - yuppers, I agree. If I happen to mention to something that I find something they've said offensive, I'm not expecting them to pass that along to the next person. I'm not even expecting them to stop saying it completely. Just hoping that they'll at least understand and try not to say it around me. If from there, they begin to say it less or ask others to stop, that's great, but I know I can't force anything on anyone. :3

 

 

 

This is kind of hilarious because in my life experience, in general, men are more likely to get worked up over children being hurt or sick than women are. Some of us may be nicer about thinking someone is just being a baby, but that doesn't mean that we're going to rush them to the doctor. x3

 

^ Not saying that's true, just a general pattern I've noticed in my life.

(There seems to be a point when me and all the girls and women I knew grew out of band-aids. The men I know, if they get a paper cut, go running to the neosporin and stick a band-aid on it. A kid gets hurt, the women will spend a second glancing it over and deem they're probably okay, just shocked, and move on. The men come rushing in offering dozens of tubes of neosporin and bad-aids, lol. Once when I got hurt when I was younger, my mom had to force my dad and his friend to not encourage me because I was fine, but they were making a big deal out of it. Although, I could probably also mention a pattern here that they're more likely to do this for girls than boys.)

I totally agree. For some reasons guys will flip out over stuff, it's quite hilarious now that you mention it. If a kid scrapes their knee men tend to xd.png while women tend to rolleyes.gif

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I once heard someone say a while ago, and I'm not saying I agree, but he made a good point...

 

If women want to be treated equally, and cripe at men about how they (meaning men) treat them like subserviants(sp?), then women don't get mad when a man asks you to fix your own d*mn car.

 

I'm a girl and I just couldn't help but laugh at that xd.png.

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I don't really see the whole debate about overweight women as sexism. Honestly, there is a huge majority of women who wouldn't want a fat man. There's also a huge majority of men who wouldn't want a fat woman. The only difference is men who want nice looking women are more noticable.

 

I admit that I have standards when it comes to a future wife.

 

I would never date someone I couldn't be physically attracted to. I wouldn't want to have to lie to her about being pretty/beautiful if I didn't believe it.

 

I'm not saying women HAVE to have a size 0 waist, but they still shouldn't be at an unhealthy weight. I'm sure if they really wanted to lose weight, they could do it. I hate the "fat is beautiful" phrase. IMO, it's an excuse to be fat and lazy and weigh well over 250 lbs.

So what are you going to do when you marry a girl and she starts aging? A person's personality is the strongest influence over the attractiveness of their physical appearance.

 

Did you know that the huge majority of playboy models have a BMI in the underweight or anorexic weight category, even WITH the weight of their huge fake breasts/butts? Men do want us at an unhealthy weight, they just have no idea what an unhealthy weight looks like for a woman.

 

I think it's strange that the male physical 'ideal' is some sort of sports athlete while the female physical 'ideal' is an unhealthy model with plastic parts.

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(There seems to be a point when me and all the girls and women I knew grew out of band-aids. The men I know, if they get a paper cut, go running to the neosporin and stick a band-aid on it. A kid gets hurt, the women will spend a second glancing it over and deem they're probably okay, just shocked, and move on. The men come rushing in offering dozens of tubes of neosporin and bad-aids, lol. Once when I got hurt when I was younger, my mom had to force my dad and his friend to not encourage me because I was fine, but they were making a big deal out of it. Although, I could probably also mention a pattern here that they're more likely to do this for girls than boys.)

I've known a few of varying stripes. Bro-in-law is the fussy sort, dad is the kind who only admits he's sick if he has a 105F fever. Mom worries if anyone is outside of her protective influence. I knew one man, he was one of a kind, God broke the mold after making him, who buried an ax in his leg and kept working after cleaning the wound out with gasoline. I was legitimately surprised when he finally died of old age. It wasn't machismo either; he was just a special old dude.

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I once heard someone say a while ago, and I'm not saying I agree, but he made a good point...

 

If women want to be treated equally, and cripe at men about how they (meaning men) treat them like subserviants(sp?), then women don't get mad when a man asks you to fix your own d*mn car.

 

I'm a girl and I just couldn't help but laugh at that xd.png.

I do agree so much. You can't whine about sexism then demand special treatment because of your sex.

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I once heard someone say a while ago, and I'm not saying I agree, but he made a good point...

 

If women want to be treated equally, and cripe at men about how they (meaning men) treat them like subserviants(sp?), then women don't get mad when a man asks you to fix your own d*mn car.

 

I'm a girl and I just couldn't help but laugh at that xd.png.

I must be missing something. I didn't know it was rude to ask someone to help fix your car. If you do ask a friend, what's wrong with a simple "no," "I don't know how," or "I don't have the time"? And in fact, the only women I know who bothers a man to do things like change the oil in her car is my mother to my father, because she does other things for him (like cook and clean) and it's a common courtesy for him to return the favor in some way.

 

I've known a few of varying stripes. Bro-in-law is the fussy sort, dad is the kind who only admits he's sick if he has a 105F fever. Mom worries if anyone is outside of her protective influence. I knew one man, he was one of a kind, God broke the mold after making him, who buried an ax in his leg and kept working after cleaning the wound out with gasoline. I was legitimately surprised when he finally died of old age. It wasn't machismo either; he was just a special old dude.

 

As I said, just the pattern in people I know. People are definitely everything and anything in between. :3

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