Communication with other users

[Fuzzbucket]

With regards to kids, we already have a link to the forums in the main header, it doesn't get any more front and center than that! And any link to the IRC would by necessity lead to the forums first. As for IRC not being the place for them.... While there are some adult topics, the rules call for PG if memory serves. We get kids in there all the time, just like we get kids on the forums. So in general, I don't think having a link / reference to the IRC topic on the forums on the main Cave would be any worse than the already existing one to the forums.

No indeed - but if you have parental software blocking all forums, the kid can get no further. I have no idea if it is as easy to block a chat channel; I do know chatzy can get around such controls unless specifically blocked as a web address..

 

(I was last in IRC less than a year ago. It was manic.)

[cyradis4]

No indeed - but if you have parental software blocking all forums, the kid can get no further. I have no idea if it is as easy to block a chat channel; I do know chatzy can get around such controls unless specifically blocked as a web address..

 

(I was last in IRC less than a year ago. It was manic.)

Given the nature of the IRC and how it needs to be connected to (ie: most need instructions the first time), any link on-site would almost certainly link to the FORUM page for IRC, and from there someone would pick their IRC client. Which means... Any parental control software would still block it.... because its a thread on a FORUM.

 

Honestly? I haven't seen the IRC as anything even remotely close to "manic" in well over 3 years, and I'm there every day. I'm sorry, but if you view the total lethargy the IRC chats have been for the last few years as "manic", any sort of in-game chat feature would drive you beyond insane.

 

Oh, there've been times of increased activity (around Holidays) but its nothing compared to what it was a few years ago.

 

Cheers!

C4.

 

 

[Fuzzbucket]

I'm sorry, but if you view the total lethargy the IRC chats have been for the last few years as "manic", any sort of in-game chat feature would drive you beyond insane.

I know. That's why I don't want one ! (I may have hit a bad day - but still. I will admit it wasn't as bad as the time, long ago, someone asked me to go there to trade and she'd meet me. THAT was REALLY horrible....)

[Thuban]

I know. That's why I don't want one ! (I may have hit a bad day - but still. I will admit it wasn't as bad as the time, long ago, someone asked me to go there to trade and she'd meet me. THAT was REALLY horrible....)

If you ever decide to visit again, give me a heads up, and I'll stick you in a much smaller room, until you get used to things

 

We have an average of 32 people most days now.. down from the averages of 150 from a few years ago

 

(but, having had that experience, im glad you can see why we dont want this to happen in the game itself... *shudders*)

[Lurhstaap]

DC's peculiar fear of built-in communication features never ceases to puzzle me. Every other game and most websites period with any sort of user login system at all that I've used in my entire life also had some form of built in communication and often multiple forms. The most common combination was PMs and either a chat or a built-in forum (NOT a forum on another site as we have here). Often there were also such things as profile comments. Not all of those sites managed to run those features effectively, but all of the successful, quality sites did just fine with it. I see absolutely no reason DC would have extra-special problems with this that hundreds of similar games haven't already solved many times over. Seriously, why is this so hard for DC when it's a basic feature on any other site? I just don't get it. It's really not that hard to set it up so that the vast majority of interactions are rule-abiding and to deal effectively with the tiny minority that are not. People who don't want to use those features can simply ignore them, or, if it's that big a deal, they can be made opt-in or opt-out.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Lurhstaap

[danicast]

DC's peculiar fear of built-in communication features never ceases to puzzle me. Every other game and most websites period with any sort of user login system at all that I've used in my entire life also had some form of built in communication and often multiple forms. The most common combination was PMs and either a chat or a built-in forum (NOT a forum on another site as we have here). Often there were also such things as profile comments. Not all of those sites managed to run those features effectively, but all of the successful, quality sites did just fine with it. I see absolutely no reason DC would have extra-special problems with this that hundreds of similar games haven't already solved many times over. Seriously, why is this so hard for DC when it's a basic feature on any other site? I just don't get it. It's really not that hard to set it up so that the vast majority of interactions are rule-abiding and to deal effectively with the tiny minority that are not. People who don't want to use those features can simply ignore them, or, if it's that big a deal, they can be made opt-in or opt-out.

I totally agree and have something to add: I have no idea why DC doesn't have a complete website with all features (like forum, PMs, etc) in one single big site like many others collection sites have, like Chicken Smoothie, as example. The presence of children is not a good argument since CS also have children and have clear policy and mechanics to deal with the users.

Seriously, why DC doesn't have a good website?

[cyradis4]

I totally agree and have something to add: I have no idea why DC doesn't have a complete website with all features (like forum, PMs, etc) in one single big site like many others collection sites have, like Chicken Smoothie, as example. The presence of children is not a good argument since CS also have children and have clear policy and mechanics to deal with the users.

Seriously, why DC doesn't have a good website?

I strongly suspect that that is because of the age of the original site and how old TJ was when he initially programmed it. If memory serves, I'd heard that it was originally more for him and his buddies. Also that it was more of a hobby, and why program something extra when you can get free software for it and spend the rest of the time doing fun programming?

 

Which is why I'd rather keep what we have and not get an in-game chat (torture to mod) or an in-game PM system (takes time to program), when our current forums serve well enough and there are so many other things that would really help the game, that are game-related?

 

Cheers!

C4.

[Fuzzbucket]

I strongly suspect that that is because of the age of the original site and how old TJ was when he initially programmed it. If memory serves, I'd heard that it was originally more for him and his buddies. Also that it was more of a hobby, and why program something extra when you can get free software for it and spend the rest of the time doing fun programming?

 

Which is why I'd rather keep what we have and not get an in-game chat (torture to mod) or an in-game PM system (takes time to program), when our current forums serve well enough and there are so many other things that would really help the game, that are game-related?

 

Cheers!

C4.

I'm TOTALLY with you. One NICE thing about DC is that it is nice and quiet. I don't play all the other games around because I don't want bells and whistles and flashy stuff. I want to collect and breed, end of. Sure, I play the events, but they are occasional things. When I want to communicate I do so on forums - this one and others - but they don't impact much on the game except for trading.

 

There is also the small (not very) matter of bandwidth. I am peculiarly aware of this, as in the UK I am on unlimited - fine - and in Canada I am on severely capped internet. I sometimes have trouble catching at all there, and if the site got all heavy, that would mean I couldn't play there at all - a bit hard, as I am there half the time. I very much feel for the large number of players who are on capped and/or slow internet It is wonderful to have a game that CAN still be played on dial-up - some people still have to put up with that. That isn't the case with CS, for one.

 

DC DOES have a good website on the whole. It just isn't as overloaded as many. One of its best features, I think.

[HeatherMarie]

I'm TOTALLY with you. One NICE thing about DC is that it is nice and quiet. I don't play all the other games around because I don't want bells and whistles and flashy stuff. I want to collect and breed, end of. Sure, I play the events, but they are occasional things. When I want to communicate I do so on forums - this one and others - but they don't impact much on the game except for trading.

 

This, so much.

 

I'm sorry, but I get sick of everyone comparing DC to other sites saying "well this site does this!". DC is NOT those sites. DC runs by it's own rules, and I'm sorry if you don't like it but that's just the way it is. I *like* DC because it *doesn't* clutter up the game with a fast-paced all-off-topic chat. I've been to those kind of games and it gets really, really annoying. And yes, in my experience, most of the chatting was totally off-topic. And how well can mods *really* rein in that sort of thing?

 

I'm sorry, but I don't see any reason why DC should have a built-in chat at the expense of what the game really *is*. We *have* a chat already. I wouldn't mind a link to the chat on the actual cave, but not in-game chat. No.

[TehUltimateMage]

The main cave site is nice and light, and I find the addition of on-site PM rather redundant because of the forums here. Then again, before signing up for DCF I was content with playing my myself and now I find these forums quite nice...

[Riverwillows]

DC is soooo much NOT "in your face", in fact, it's very much a mellow, do your own thing kind of site. I too have played many games online, all types, been in many types of forums, and one thing I do like about DC is that it IS more quiet, yet busy, and everyone is (mostly) polite and considerate.

 

And yeah, it is really irritating when people come in and try to change the site to what THEY are more used to, maybe they don't realize that doing so would ruin DC.

 

If it ain't broke, why fix it? And it ain't!!!!

[danicast]

If it ain't broke, why fix it? And it ain't!!!!

Because it can be IMPROVED.

DC would be a much better experience with all in one single place, one single url instead of this mix of chat in one place, forum in another (and a very outdated forum btw), chat in a third place, different logins and all that mess.

If it can be better why not? I'm not afraid of progress.

Edited January 14, 2016 by danicast

[Riverwillows]

But what one person coming in from other games and forums sees 'improvement', the rest of us who've been playing DC forever knows it's disaster. We know this game. Improvements are nice yes, and TJ does give us those that are really necessary, but most of the time, "improvements" are not really needed.

 

Just because you can, does not mean you should. Or is needed.

[purplehaze]

I'm not afraid of progress, either, but not all change is true progress. I am not at all convinced that DC would be a "better experience" with the changes you are suggesting.

[danicast]

I'm not afraid of progress, either, but not all change is true progress. I am not at all convinced that DC would be a "better experience" with the changes you are suggesting.

It will be, for sure.

You need to PM a user, any user? You can, because any user who have a scroll will have also a PM inbox with the same username.

You need to chat with a user, any user? You can, for the same reason.

No more "I wonder if the user have the same name in forum", no more "I wonder if that user use the forum", no more "I would like to discuss a trade with a user but I don't know how to contact them", no more different messages in the sigs in the hope to reach a person.

There are so many advantages in have a website with all functions in one place!

I play Chicken Smoothie and I don't need to waiste hours of my time seeking people to make trades or trying to contact someone to solve a problem (because there is a FUNCTIONAL help system there) or ask randomly in the forum in the hope that someone can help me.

There are gazillions of threads about trades, I'm always trading there. I've been playing there for less than six months and I'm already have a collection of rares because trades are much easier to do there because the pets and the forum are in the same place. I've been here for years and don't have as many rares as I would like to have.

When you have a smooth functional website the game flows better.

And I was NEVER harassed there, not one single time. So clearly it works better.

[Riverwillows]

So clearly it works better.

Yes, FOR THAT FORUM. Not necessarily here. Again, you have experiences with some forums. That does not mean what worked there, will work here. People don't seem to understand this.

[danicast]

Yes, FOR THAT FORUM. Not necessarily here. Again, you have experiences with some forums. That does not mean what worked there, will work here. People don't seem to understand this.

The only reason that occur to me that such organized and functional structure will not work "here" is if people doesn't want to make it work and decide to sabotage the system.

Because the system is pretty neat, efficient and very organized. The game flows so much better than DC!

 

[Thuban]

The only reason that occur to me that such organized and functional structure will not work "here" is if people doesn't want to make it work and decide to sabotage the system.

Because the system is pretty neat, efficient and very organized. The game flows so much better than DC!

Chickensmoothie is not a good thing to compare to this site. You have had good luck there, I havent, and I've been there since late 09. I got scammed multiple times out of over $80 worth of trades, with no help when I asked mods what to do about it. My choices were deal with it, or let them reverse the trade, which could have possibly meant hundreds of users having pets disappear from their collections, all because of a couple of people who couldnt hold up their end of the bargain.

 

Sure chat IS fun, and I get faster trades when i bother to trade, but I am a user who HATES sites that force me to use their forums/chats in order to accomplish things. Outside of this section, and the occasional help post, you may notice I dont post much. I spent a long time playing this game on my own, using only livejournal groups in the beginning. The forums back then were pretty horrific, and i wanted nothing to do with them. Many, many people view the current chat, the same way I viewed the forums. This game does not need chat/messaging systems built into it. The day that happens, my kids will no longer be allowed to play. I will very likely stop playing as well. I can think of quite a few other members with younger kids that would not be allowing them to play anymore. I can think of quite a few users who would leave, because they cant handle the traffic that comes with built in features like that.

 

Links leading to forum profiles that are completely optional, is enough. A link to the chat, is enough. We do not need these things built into the game itself. FR, im realizing more and more i will have to use the forums to get what I need, unless I want to spend money. If it wasnt for the chat we have, I wouldnt be playing this game, on account of needing forums to get information and things I need. I am perfectly content with my bubble of dc, being a solo play zone, where I only interact with people on my terms. Having raffle dramas, and event dramas invading my scroll directly is just not something i want to see.

[Fuzzbucket]

The only reason that occur to me that such organized and functional structure will not work "here" is if people doesn't want to make it work and decide to sabotage the system.

Because the system is pretty neat, efficient and very organized. The game flows so much better than DC!

Then play it. You like Chickensmoothie. That's wonderful. I like DC. I do NOT like Chickensmoothie (I went and had a look after the last time you wanted DC changed to be like that. I loathe it.) Many others feel the same way. VARIETY is nice.

 

If DC is something you don't like, to the extent you want to change it into something completely different, to be more like something else - why not just stick with that something else, and let those of us who like DC JUST THE WAY IT IS enjoy it that way. If the changes you want were implemented - it would be a MUCH less pleasant place for me and many others, and I actually might give up. Many of us want a game like THIS one, not zazzed up to be like some other one.

 

tl:dr - variety is the spice of life. A link to your forum ID - an OPTIONAL link - is all that is needed to cover the issue raised by the OP.

[Clya]

If DC is something you don't like, to the extent you want to change it into something completely different, to be more like something else - why not just stick with that something else, and let those of us who like DC JUST THE WAY IT IS enjoy it that way. If the changes you want were implemented - it would be a MUCH less pleasant place for me and many others, and I actually might give up. Many of us want a game like THIS one, not zazzed up to be like some other one.

^^ Couldn't have said it better myself.

DC is DC. End of story. It's not other sites, it is it's own. And we don't really need big changes to "make it better" when the system it has now is more than fine, and makes it unique from other sites. Personally I don't want to have to deal with whatever PM system is added, or chat system or whatever. If I wanted to chat with people or trade, I WOULD GO TO THE FORUM!

Even if I didn't want to have a forum account I could still find trades, or even post one on EATW.

[danicast]

I personally think that change is unavoidable because the userbase change all the time and young people like change. DC needs to change or it will die with time.

You talk against the change and you are not seeing that DC is already changing, right in front of your eyes. The Christmas event is one of the proofs of this change from those silly non interactive events to something much more vivid and interesting.

I'll look forward to see the changed, evolved, more modern DC.

It's a personal choice to give up to play DC when DC change. I'm pretty sure most people will be interested in an upgraded game with a rich site than the people who give up of the game because they were attached to the old not so good site.

Edited January 15, 2016 by danicast

[purplehaze]

Well, Fuzz, I guess us old fogies have just been written off as collateral damage from "improvements"!

 

I have to agree that I was attracted to this game instead of CS and others because of its simplicity and lack of bells and whistles. If that makes me a minority and not worth worrying about, so be it, but I shall make my voice heard at every opportunity just the same.

[HeatherMarie]

I think it's important to voice again how many *younger* users (since apparently old users aren't worth worrying about) this change would lose. Parents that don't allow their children on chat sites will shut down DC fast. The forums are completely separate, with it's own sign-in thing and everything. But a chat built directly into DC will make a lot of parents *block* DC, thus losing many young players. And I'm not speaking hypothetically, there have already been people in this thread saying that their children/grandchildren wouldn't be able to play.

 

But I guess that's not important either if DC *must* change, right?

[Fuzzbucket]

Well, as an old fogey who doesn't want this feature or any other whizzy stuff to spoil what is mercifully a very different game from most on line - one of the reasons so MANY of us are here and not elsewhere - I will go hide in a corner and enjoy it till it is wrecked by the change for change sake's brigade.

 

I'm depressed now. I love the game as it is, and for someone to tell me how awful and inferior it is is really sad.

[purplehaze]

I really think that the number of registered users who are NOT members of the forum speaks more to the lack of need for communication than it does to a need to find a way to communicate with them!