Egg Circulation

[Lythiaren]

Right now people are not talking about AP blocking, they are talking about the cave being open, but having a wall of three of the same kind that aren't going anywhere anytime soon.  And that when one of the three IS actually taken, is soon replaced by the same breed, or another breed that isn't taken.

I've seen that happening a lot lately myself, and the worst part is whenever I'm clicking through biomes I only see 3-6 people in any given cave. One or two areas will be cleared right out, but the others tend to have something clogging things up in each one. That is, until I come along and take one, lately I've been picking up and raising the cave blockers for the sake of getting things moving again (and the ability to snarkily comment that I'm doing my part yadda yadda even though I probably won't ever need to say it). Anyone else with a gold trophy can easily do the same, we can take 1-2 eggs a day without locking down.

 

In fact, everything I have growing right now was grabbed off the cave or AP, and each one had been sitting. Including the gen 2 magis and purple, and almost-even gen 4 white.

Edited June 24, 2011 by Lythiaren

[Fiona]

Someone has to be raising them, even if the original catcher is just dumping them. The AP isn't a solid wall of hundreds of Whiptails.

Have you ever watched what happens at the top of the hour when the cave generates a new queue of eggs? Whatever was left from the last hour "poofs." Now, there could very well have been a bunch of stripes/golds/whatever behind the three whiptails that were just sitting there not getting picked up, but I think it far more likely that there were more whiptails, mints, neos, etc. All those "cave cloggers" that were "poofed" at the top of the hour are just going to have to be regenerated, because of course their numbers are still low. But no, no one raised them. They just keep getting regenerated at the top of each hour, and no one takes them, so they "poof" and get regenerated for the next hour.

[Anke]

Can I ask something?

 

How often is the cave *actually blocked* lately? Like, honestly.

The last six or so hourly drops I wanted to use for hunting, five of them either didn't happen because the cave was blocked, or were over after half a minute or a minute because the cave got blocked then.

[elderberrysyrup]

I still am of the opinion that this is no fault of the system, but fault of the members themselves. We need to organize something to remove the clutter. With the new limits, this should not be a problem at all. No, seriously! In the trading section, there are at least 4-5 active threads working to clear the clutter. A person even gets rares in return for most if not all of them.

 

I honestly think this would not be as much of a problem if more members simply picked up more commons. I personally have come to appreciate the sprites of commons and just pickup whatever I can find at the time, usually sprites I enjoy.

[Nectaris]

I still am of the opinion that this is no fault of the system, but fault of the members themselves. We need to organize something to remove the clutter. With the new limits, this should not be a problem at all. No, seriously! In the trading section, there are at least 4-5 active threads working to clear the clutter. A person even gets rares in return for most if not all of them.

 

I honestly think this would not be as much of a problem if more members simply picked up more commons. I personally have come to appreciate the sprites of commons and just pickup whatever I can find at the time, usually sprites I enjoy.

Personally, I think it is a combination of both. To me, the system shouldn't be asking you to spend weeks raising dragons that you have no desire for. However, given the low numbers of these breeds, there does need to be some user interest generated for these breeds as well.

 

 

Edited June 24, 2011 by Nectaris

[MedievalMystic]

Something needs to give with the cave that's for sure. At least I think so. Unless you're hunting right at the top of the hour, you won't find squat except the same few breeds in every biome, all the time. It gets old. I want to be able to hunt whenever and know that wanted and desirable eggs could pop up anytime...not just 2 minutes at the top of each hour.

[purpledragonclaw]

From what I've experienced, it is possible that players are taking the blockers, but they're just being replaced by more blockers, so it looks like nothing's changed between a few clicks of the mouse. When I hit the Volcano for Guardians I pick one up and sometimes, as soon as I go back, another Guardian is there in its place. It is entirely possible that in the ten seconds it took me to grab the Guardian and return to the Volcano, another egg appeared that someone else wanted that was replaced with another Guardian, but I think that's unlikely.

[KageSora]

From what I've experienced, it is possible that players are taking the blockers, but they're just being replaced by more blockers, so it looks like nothing's changed between a few clicks of the mouse. When I hit the Volcano for Guardians I pick one up and sometimes, as soon as I go back, another Guardian is there in its place. It is entirely possible that in the ten seconds it took me to grab the Guardian and return to the Volcano, another egg appeared that someone else wanted that was replaced with another Guardian, but I think that's unlikely.

It does happen from time to time, but often I just see the exact same three sitting there--I check the codes after a while, and they have the same codes usually...

[counselor]

I think the only way to get more circulation in this would be to change the ratios. Make commons still common but not that common like they are now. But I don't think TJ plans on changing ratios. And it's his game, he makes the rules.

 

I use commons for personal projects, but I won't raise eggs I don't really need or want. So I'm stuck with my projects. Not able to catch cb blacks, striped, metallic because I don't see them. Not able to breed any eggs from my metallics, blacks, striped (current breeding situation). Not able to trade for things I would like to have, because most people trade only for blacks, stripes, metallic (including tinsel) and I'm not able to catch or breed them.

 

I try to make the best of it.

Edited June 26, 2011 by counselor

[Fhee]

For sure it was explained somewhere else, but may i ask...why not alts? Maybe not regular alts (like Nebulas, blacks etc) but just different colours? If stone dragons come in different colours i would collect them (even old ones) cause it would look cool.

Please, if this idea is screwed let me know, i love understanding things

And i started collecting commons (at least i picked 2 eggs) so you see, im trying to solve problems...

[KageSora]

For sure it was explained somewhere else, but may i ask...why not alts? Maybe not regular alts (like Nebulas, blacks etc) but just different colours? If stone dragons come in different colours i would collect them (even old ones) cause it would look cool.

Please, if this idea is screwed let me know, i love understanding things

And i started collecting commons (at least i picked 2 eggs) so you see, im trying to solve problems...

The thing with that is that we'd then need permission from the original creator(s) of the sprites--and if they say no, well, there's nothing we can do about that.

 

But if we could get their permission and could have different-colored versions of some of the blockers, that would be really cool--I know I'd possibly collect quite a few more of certain blockers if they had different colors.

[Fhee]

I have checked that Stone dragons were created by CaityG (Adult), Pokemonfan13 (Adult) and Shikaru (Hatchling).

Dunno if they are still active (sorry...) or willing to change things with dragons, but maybe there is a way to let creators know about this idea?

Seems that its no harm to change colours, not that much effort and it could help with stones being so unpopular. Still, they would remain commons, but more desirable.

[Rally Vincent]

How about a "cave scroll" (with no limit so it won't get locked) which grabs the egg on the left side from each biome once every 60 seconds, keep them for 72 hours and then abandon them to the AP. Those ER eggs will be grabbed quickly; each biome would have a new egg guaranteed at least every sixty seconds and the AP would be a nicer place to hunt. Only problem I see is that people won't grab regular AP eggs as often...

[KageSora]

I have checked that Stone dragons were created by CaityG (Adult), Pokemonfan13 (Adult) and Shikaru (Hatchling).

Dunno if they are still active (sorry...) or willing to change things with dragons, but maybe there is a way to let creators know about this idea?

Seems that its no harm to change colours, not that much effort and it could help with stones being so unpopular. Still, they would remain commons, but more desirable.

PF13 is still active, but IIRC Shikaru isn't active anymore. Shikaru may be able to be contacted still, though, through other sites. As for CaityG, she doesn't post much on the forums anymore but her scroll shows recent activity so it may be possible to contact her via PM.

 

However, I don't know if any of them would be interested in doing something like this, and they'd likely all have to agree, since it's a jointly created set of sprites.

 

And just because it's simple to do doesn't mean that they'd be willing to do it. They may also be unwilling to let others do it--the sprite art is something that people can be very possessive over, and rightly so as they did put in hard work to create it. Having others edit their hard work is not something that they may wish to allow for that reason, and they may feel displeased that people feel they need to make alts to make the work more appealing--I know I wouldn't be happy if somebody told me "Hey, your work is clogging things up, mind changing things up a bit to maybe make it wanted or something?"

 

 

Also, a recolor can only go so far--more people would likely be interested if they had new sprites, too, but that obviously is more work.

 

 

 

Any artists who are willing to do a recolored alt, however, that's awesome. But I wouldn't wanna cause trouble by asking 'em to change their work to make it "more wanted" or anything... Artists tend to be rather easily offended when their work is considered unwanted, and they have good reason to be--they put hard work into making it, after all. And in these cases, their work was already accepted into the Cave--it's not like it's a work in progress that they want critiques on to improve...

[Fhee]

While i agree with you on most part i really feel that it could help. Its not that i find stones or any other dragons unatractive.

Lets face the truth-its an old and common race, so almost everyone has at least a pair. Its not changing the original form, just adding some twist, lets say-refreshing them.

Thats how i would see it.

Anyway, i wont make mess, and if it would hurt someone's feeling-better leave it.

So, what are others way to solve the problem? I really would like to have a normal cave site, so like everyone here.

[KageSora]

While i agree with you on most part i really feel that it could help. Its not that i find stones or any other dragons unatractive.

Lets face the truth-its an old and common race, so almost everyone has at least a pair. Its not changing the original form, just adding some twist, lets say-refreshing them.

Thats how i would see it.

Anyway, i wont make mess, and if it would hurt someone's feeling-better leave it.

So, what are others way to solve the problem? I really would like to have a normal cave site, so like everyone here.

I know what you mean, but when it comes to the work somebody put a lot of effort into, which was then deemed good enough as it was, it's easy to offend without meaning to if you suggest a change. If somebody wanted to ask, they should approach the subject carefully and respectfully. Artists can be a sensitive lot--I speak as one!

[jumpsnake]

I think I may have mentioned this before, but maybe not here...

 

Would it be possible to uncouple the CB ratios from the bred ratios? Rares would still be rare, commons would still be commons, but the ratio of cave-generated eggs would be separate from the ratio of bred eggs. I assume they would be the same ratios, but they wouldn't be linked. So CB stripes and blacks would still exist, but people breeding the crap out of them wouldn't make them impossible to get.

 

TJ? Are you reading this thread? Would you mind letting us know if this is simply a terrible idea, or is it possible? I have no idea about coding and such, so i understand if it just wouldn't work, and I hate to keep on about it if it is simply not a possibility.

 

I also think that the ratios of CB *FOR COMMONS ONLY* should be tied to the amount of time the egg sits in the cave. Sits for 30 seconds vs. 1? the 30 second egg is generated less frequently and the 1 sec egg is generated more frequently. No affect on uncommons and rares, but this I think would also solve some of the same 3 blocking eggs problem.

[~!~]

Would it be possible to uncouple the CB ratios from the bred ratios? Rares would still be rare, commons would still be commons, but the ratio of cave-generated eggs would be separate from the ratio of bred eggs. I assume they would be the same ratios, but they wouldn't be linked. So CB stripes and blacks would still exist, but people breeding the crap out of them wouldn't make them impossible to get.

I'd support something like this. Perhaps the likelihood of an egg of a certain breed being bred went down as the population of bred eggs of that breed went up, everything could stay balanced.

 

Of course, I just know that somebody will say "But I don't want somebody else mass-breeding their Blacks to interfere with my ability to breed a Black. This will just make it harder for me to play the game my way." I just know somebody who read this post thought that. (Except that no, they'll say "No, no, no, absolutely no. I will never support this. My opinion matters more than yours.")

 

Well you know what? My ability to catch a CB black shouldn't be hindered by someone else breeding all their Blacks either.

 

I also think that the ratios of CB *FOR COMMONS ONLY* should be tied to the amount of time the egg sits in the cave. Sits for 30 seconds vs. 1? the 30 second egg is generated less frequently and the 1 sec egg is generated more frequently. No affect on uncommons and rares, but this I think would also solve some of the same 3 blocking eggs problem.

This would work on uncommons and rares as well, so long as it wasn't the same formula. Perhaps if the cave sees that a common egg takes around 8 seconds to be grabbed, it'll make a hundred of them at the next drop, but if it sees a rare sit around for 8 seconds, it'll make ten. That way, if one rare happens to be more popular than another for some reason, there will be more of them than of the other rare dragons, but still considerably less than any common.

 

Even so, it wouldn't matter that much if there were physically more, say, Silvers than Nocturnes, so long as it was much easier to get a Nocturne than a Silver. That's what rarity is all about in a collection game.

[libby2999]

Its so annoying when I see three "this egg is sitting in front of the others." First of all, how can all three sit in front? lol and it just is so annoying cuz I just want an egg to repay for a trade, but I cant get it sadly cuz of all the blockage.

 

I do miss the old times when I saw a rare and my heart was racing. Now a days, I see it, hit refresh on accepdent, i click but im off so it takes me time to move the cusor to the egg, then click and. O.o I got it, that wasnt fun so I offer it away.

[~!~]

How about a "cave scroll" (with no limit so it won't get locked) which grabs the egg on the left side from each biome once every 60 seconds, keep them for 72 hours and then abandon them to the AP. Those ER eggs will be grabbed quickly; each biome would have a new egg guaranteed at least every sixty seconds and the AP would be a nicer place to hunt. Only problem I see is that people won't grab regular AP eggs as often...

Perhaps the cave scroll could grab eggs that stay on the AP for more than some amount of time as well? I'd guess longer than a minute... perhaps two?

[Rally Vincent]

I guess it would be possible to do so, but I don't know if TJ would like to only have ER eggs on the AP? It'll be five CB ER eggs from the cave scroll (I leave out desert because that one empties on itself) perminute, and people would wait for those. It wouldn't hurt for "regular" AP eggs to stay for at least an hour or so.

 

Oh man, this is a really good idea.  ER eggs are usually snatched up pretty quickly, regardless of breed.  And since all the eggs would eventually be released back to the users, it wouldn't matter that much if the cave scroll took a more desirable breed (say, during a new release).

 

It would have to be turned off while the cave is blocked, though.

Quoted from Cave feedback thread. This is a good point.

Edited July 21, 2011 by Rally Vincent

[Saloiq]

I guess it would be possible to do so, but I don't know if TJ would like to only have ER eggs on the AP? It'll be five CB ER eggs from the cave scroll (I leave out desert because that one empties on itself) perminute, and people would wait for those. It wouldn't hurt for "regular" AP eggs to stay for at least an hour or so.

Yes, people would probably wait for the blocker ER eggs from the AP instead of picking new blocker eggs up and hatching them themselves, so that could be a problem. I'm kind of ashamed to admit it, but I certainly would. >_>;

[~!~]

Yes, people would probably wait for the blocker ER eggs from the AP instead of picking new blocker eggs up and hatching them themselves, so that could be a problem. I'm kind of ashamed to admit it, but I certainly would. >_>;

Especially knowing they'd be CB.

[Rally Vincent]

But at least a higher amount of cave blocker eggs would be hatched, and via the ratios other, more "desirable" eggs would show. People could benefit from both; some will get ER eggs, others a bigger variety in the biomes.

 

I myself would take a blocker egg once in a while when it is an ER egg, but I probably won't catch them from the cave.

[olympe]

Also, don't forget you don't have an endless supply of slots for additional hatchies. So, the ER solution isn't quite bad, really. (A gold trophy owner could get up to 7 additional hatchies this way - but only if he doesn't use incubate, or he will be locked afterwards.)