Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) I feel like a freakin' hypocrite here, because after everything I've posted, the DC-gods *finally* blessed me with two vine eggs, a magi egg, a purple egg, and a red egg!! (Of course, that's out of 15 vine-breeds, 10 black-breeds (didn't get any blacks at all), and more then a few "random-click just want an eggggggg!"). edit: Oh, so my negatives of that breeding-spree: Not one black egg, despite blacks being "common". Not one stripe egg, which I kinda of figured. Not one silver or gold egg. Edited July 17, 2011 by Marie19R Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I have about 40 golds and I've only managed to breed ONE gold out of the whole lot, even after I sic the fertility BSA on most of them. Ironically, the one gold egg I managed to get was not hit with that BSA. About 80% of the others were just moody so "no egg was produced" Seriously, I actually think the Biomes are totally wasted cos lots of eggs appear in all Biomes so why are we even having different locations for "certain" eggs to appear? A few people I know have stated that visiting all these Biomes are pretty tiring( and I totally agree with them) and they're starting to lose interest in this game because running around to different areas, wondering in certain eggs would appear here or there is just too frustrating. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 Update: We want Forum Feedback! http://forums.dragcave.net/index.php?showt...dpost&p=5240710 Trust me. I do quite a bit more reading than I do posting, although I don't have a "positive" posts-per-day count from not communicating. I make sure to check the site daily if not more frequently (even while on vacation, like right now). I've written numerous tools that track the dragon populations, and I watch various graphs to make sure things are progressing in the right direction (which they are). And don't say "well if you're checking on the site and nothing's wrong, then tell us." Because I have done in the past and still do. Apparently no one believes me when I say things are working. They don't want me to say "everything's fine," they want me to confirm their belief that things aren't fine. I don't really want to go into this here (this isn't the thread for it), but since it's the only reason people are posting in this topic (right now), there's no reason not to: There's also the misconception that saying "nothing's wrong" regarding the ratios means "this is how common the dragon breeds are, and how they'll always be." And that's false. The ratios are, of course, "off." It doesn't take me to tell you that. But why are they so far off? Because, until recently, I wasn't willing to actually enforce them. I guess you guys got spoiled with being able to continuously overbreed rares until their populations rival that of commons (which they did), because now that things are being fixed, you can't handle it. Another important tidbit: Saying "the ratios" have been getting progressively worse since 09 is flat-out false. Why? Because the site only takes into account dragons from the past year. The code doesn't care what happened back in 09, it's been long forgotten. I've said this before, but apparently it's been forgotten too. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 Does anyone remember when people complained about AP being constantly clogged? I do and I'm glad that as a side effect of low breeding ratios we get working biomes. Although I was a bit irked by TJ's 'nothing's wrong' messages which suggested we're all hallucinating. I'm satisfied with the answer above, it says all I wanted to hear form the site owner. Pity it wasn't posted 3 months ago Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 Fertility just failed again big time for me. Two in a row, used fertility, both no interest. Not no egg, no interest. Both are proven pairs. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I'm actually kind of upset that I'll probably never be able to breed rares/blacks/stripes and such because of what people did before I joined the site. That's a major bummer for me. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I'm actually kind of upset that I'll probably never be able to breed rares/blacks/stripes and such because of what people did before I joined the site. That's a major bummer for me. I think they will work out eventually. Things like the plumbers and the common collection should help. I don't know about other people but when my black linage went cold I started up a couple linages that are all commons. Maybe more people are doing this so the ratios will even out faster. Hope you find those rares you are looking for. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I think they will work out eventually. Things like the plumbers and the common collection should help. I don't know about other people but when my black linage went cold I started up a couple linages that are all commons. Maybe more people are doing this so the ratios will even out faster. Hope you find those rares you are looking for. Yeah, I know the ratios will eventually even out. And then what will happen? People will go ballistic and overbreed again. And why wouldn't they? Free rares! And then everything will go out of whack, and people will complain, and it'll start all over again, lol. And then some poor future newbie will wonder why he/she has to be punished for what happened on the site before he/she joined, ect. ect. ect. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) Fertility just failed again big time for me. Two in a row, used fertility, both no interest. Not no egg, no interest. Both are proven pairs. This . I used Fertility for 6 breedings on the same pair . They produced only one egg with FAILtility so far and the first one they ever produced, was without . So it was like this 1st breeding : no egg 2nd breeding : EGG 3rd breeding + F = no egg 4th breeding + F = EGG 5th breeding + F = no egg 6th breeding + F = no egg 7th breeding + F = no egg 8th breeding + F = no egg +F stands for the breedings for which I used fertility and I even tried to fertalize BOTH partners on the 7th breeding, just for the lulz (even if I know that it will do nothing) . This breeding thing above also counts for my CB female Gold, from which I am trying to get commons out . I used 7 failtilities on her on 8 breedings ... nooo egg . My newest Bronze Tinsel has those stats with Failtility : 1st breeding + F = refusal (ferti. does not count here then, of course) 2nd breeding + F = no egg 3rd breeding = EGG (which was today and without F) So um yeah ... those are the only 3 dragons I keep record of failtility using, for myself .... P.S.: I do agree with Cinnamin . Edited July 17, 2011 by Shichibi Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 Yeah, I know the ratios will eventually even out. And then what will happen? People will go ballistic and overbreed again. And why wouldn't they? Free rares! I don't know that the ratios will swing that wildly out of control. (at least I hope not and if they do I would hope TJ would tweak the system.) It is my understanding that the ratios are so far out of balance right now because they were not strictly enforced in the past. Now that they are going to be continually in place things should come to some sort of balance and then maintain over time. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 so roughly how long do you all think it will take for the ratios to fix so blacks n all the good ole cave blockers will return to us? or atleast breeding to go back to what it used to be Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I tried to breed my rares again......and again I got no eggs from my metallics, stripes and blacks. Even the fertility bsa is not working for them. Like others said before, I get only eggs from my commons if I do not use that bsa. At the moment some of my projects are put on hold and I am collecting commons, hoping that the ratios will get fixed that way. But it is frustrating. I tried to be patient and wait for the ratios to fix themselves, but to be honest this whole situation is nibbling on my fun to play this game. Do not get me wrong, I do not even know much about the ratios and I see the point in the argument of overbreeding rares in the past. But seeing only statistics will cause problems: I understand that metallics are rare and that they should be difficult to breed. But there is a difference in just difficult and impossible (to me it looks like it is impossible these days). And for me that is not a good development. I think that at some point even the biggest fans of this game will leave frustrated, because they can not go on with their lineages. My lineage projects ARE the reason why I am still playing DC, not AP or Cave hunting, not even to complete my scroll and spending hours, days or weeks to get the eggs I need to fulfill that goal. If the aspect of breeding successfully is taken away this game is no longer interesting for an old stager. And what about newbies? I started to play DC over 2 years ago and it was fun. But if I imagine I would start to play now as a newbie I think I would lose my interest quite fast because it seems to be unlikely to get rare eggs (I can not imagine that the GGG or the Giving tree is doing well these days but I do not watch them constantly. I could imagine that there a far more requests then eggs to gift.). Or would you try to trade or even ask for a metallic gift while even users with 50 or more golds are not able to breed a gold egg from them? The longer this lack of wanted eggs lasts the higher will be their worth in a trade. If I remember correctly I was not able to offer much for a metallic as a newbie. I am afraid that even users playing for a long time can not afford to gift their rares in the future because they will need them to get the things they are missing to complete their scrolls. Or, like Derranged said, everything will start again, because rares will be overbreed again. Like I said before I do not know much about the ratios, but I do not understand that some breeds have now nearly stopped to produce eggs. I think there are more active players than ever and we have got the new limits. More players and a higher egg limit means that there are more eggs around in general and in my opinion there should be a lack of metallics and especially black stripes at the moment after nearly four month of only a few succesful breedings of stripes. I wonder if even four month of nearly no stripes and a lot of new players could not balancing out a short period of mass breeding black stripes . Maybe I am messing things up, excuse me. But like I said, I think that nobody is really interested in statistics or the ratios and if they are running fine or not. But it is important how users feel about being lucky with getting the eggs they want. Waiting for an egg (rare or not) for a few month is getting those who are interested in lineage-projects nowhere. And how long should newbies wait for their first metallic? I am afraid this whole problem could be an existential problem of this game. Four month is a long time and maybe another four month period of waiting and frustration will force many users to leave the game, just a thought and maybe way to pessimistic but what I am feeling during the past few month. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 I bred 90+ golds 2 days ago and got 1 common egg. It is getting ridiculous. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 17, 2011 Update: We want Forum Feedback! http://forums.dragcave.net/index.php?showt...dpost&p=5240710 QUOTE (TJ09 @ Jul 16 2011, 10:21 PM) Trust me. I do quite a bit more reading than I do posting, although I don't have a "positive" posts-per-day count from not communicating. I make sure to check the site daily if not more frequently (even while on vacation, like right now). I've written numerous tools that track the dragon populations, and I watch various graphs to make sure things are progressing in the right direction (which they are). And don't say "well if you're checking on the site and nothing's wrong, then tell us." Because I have done in the past and still do. Apparently no one believes me when I say things are working. They don't want me to say "everything's fine," they want me to confirm their belief that things aren't fine. I don't really want to go into this here (this isn't the thread for it), but since it's the only reason people are posting in this topic (right now), there's no reason not to: There's also the misconception that saying "nothing's wrong" regarding the ratios means "this is how common the dragon breeds are, and how they'll always be." And that's false. The ratios are, of course, "off." It doesn't take me to tell you that. But why are they so far off? Because, until recently, I wasn't willing to actually enforce them. I guess you guys got spoiled with being able to continuously overbreed rares until their populations rival that of commons (which they did), because now that things are being fixed, you can't handle it. Another important tidbit: Saying "the ratios" have been getting progressively worse since 09 is flat-out false. Why? Because the site only takes into account dragons from the past year. The code doesn't care what happened back in 09, it's been long forgotten. I've said this before, but apparently it's been forgotten too. Reposting for a new page so more users might see TJ's answer. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 (edited) Something is clearly wrong with breeding if super common cave cloggers are unable to breed successfully. edit: long ago quote from tj July 2009 (9:47:33 PM) TJ09: Whether or not a pair successfully produces an egg is not affected in any way by the ratios. (9:48:09 PM) bluebell_rose: but by the ap? (9:48:45 PM) TJ09: Yes. Except the breeding success is low even when the ap is unclogged and tj09 How recently? I've been here since 2007. As I recall there was a balancing glitch in the coding discovered in 2009. Sometime between early July and end of June in 2009. Because, until recently, I wasn't willing to actually enforce them. I guess you guys got spoiled with being able to continuously overbreed rares until their populations rival that of commons (which they did), because now that things are being fixed, you can't handle it. Happened since 2009, ratios' been off since then, and dc's been trying to fix it for 2 years. Unless the balancing system somehow got borked again. Another important tidbit: Saying "the ratios" have been getting progressively worse since 09 is flat-out false. Why? Because the site only takes into account dragons from the past year. The code doesn't care what happened back in 09, it's been long forgotten. I've said this before, but apparently it's been forgotten too. Then how come the site is still trying to fix the problem that was discovered in 2009. I.E the metallic overbreeding because of the balancing glitch? Edited July 18, 2011 by bluebell_rose Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 I didn't breed anything yesterday with my golds and silvers but I hope with all the purple hatchies/eggs I have collected that will change Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 I tried breed all golds, color stripes, silvers but no successful but they did together but said no produced eggs oh well.. what happen that even since stopped? Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 Well, I only have 6 metallics, and I actually managed to breed one silver recently. (The last metallics before then were during the recent metallic breeding spree a few months ago.) Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 I've always had terrible luck with metallic breeding..My silvers haven't bred a silver offspring for more than a year now, and my gold has never bred a gold. The day that one of them decides to produce a shiny offspring will be a fantastic, wondrous, amazingly happy day for me. My trios all seem more than willing to breed though.. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 I've always had terrible luck with metallic breeding..My silvers haven't bred a silver offspring for more than a year now, and my gold has never bred a gold. The day that one of them decides to produce a shiny offspring will be a fantastic, wondrous, amazingly happy day for me. That about sums me up too! Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 Hah! Me too. The last shiny egg I bred was last Christmas, and I about had a heart attack when I saw that gold egg pop up. Before that I'd been trying for over a year and a half to breed a second gen gold egg. In that time frame I'd bred a couple silvers, but no golds. So, in 2 years I've gotten something like 2 silvers and 1 gold egg. I don't breed all my golds and silvers every week, just the ones with nice lineages. But that's still quite a few. The current success rate of tinsels is reeeeeaaaaallly nice though. I hope that continues forever, because I love shiny things. Um. another comment I would like to make to be clear here. I attribute my lack of shiny eggs more to atrocious luck than anything being wrong with breeding ratios. If it involves any kind of RNG I'm mostly gonna be outta luck. Dunno why that is, but it's always been true. I think my life has a natural -5 roll modifier to it. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 18, 2011 Last gold I bred (and kept) was in Dec 2010 http://dragcave.net/lineage/Y2mo Last silver I bred (and kept) Mar 2010 http://dragcave.net/lineage/fOMg I gifted a gold in Mar 2011 and a silver in Jan 2011 Last stripe Mar 2011 http://dragcave.net/lineage/Z3bH too many to check to see if I gifted any Share this post Link to post
Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) I did breed a silver on July 5 which I kept because it was a thuwed lineage and I wanted a male silver thuwed for my collection. My last silver before July 5 - near as I can tell from records Dec 06 2010 - it was gifted to my niece. Got a few silvers eggs in 2010 that were gifted. I have 23 non inbred silvers bred frequently. 3 inbred silvers which are almost never bred. So I have gone six months or more without a silver. Last Gold - March 21 2011 before that had a gold egg Mar 06/11, feb 21/11, Jan 15 and Jan 2 from different golds on my scroll most gifted out. I have 21 non inbred golds on my scroll. 1 inbred gold. 4 months with no golds bred. Last stripes - my stripes have always been finicky with breeding but I got two black stripes last week. Both placed in new homes. Given away numerous gold in my time and I must say some of my golds were very good about producing gold eggs frequently and some of my gold dragons have rarely given me gold eggs. The same can be said for the silvers some were very good breeders of the rares, and some were not. Of course a lot of this was during times when rares were easier to get with breeding too. Edited July 19, 2011 by Ramica Share this post Link to post
Posted July 19, 2011 Something is clearly wrong with breeding if super common cave cloggers are unable to breed successfully. edit: long ago quote from tj July 2009 (9:47:33 PM) TJ09: Whether or not a pair successfully produces an egg is not affected in any way by the ratios. (9:48:09 PM) bluebell_rose: but by the ap? (9:48:45 PM) TJ09: Yes. Except the breeding success is low even when the ap is unclogged Back in 2009 the AP affected breeding. This is no longer true. Share this post Link to post
Posted July 19, 2011 Maybe I'm being too simplistic here, but couldn't the ratios just be changed? Share this post Link to post
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