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Question about a trade?

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If I wanted to produce a Holly arrowhead - meaning I'd need descendants of a CB female(there are just 7 CB f known to exist:() and a CB male, which generation I could potentially be most likely to get both for? And what more or less I could trade to get these?

Edited by VixenDra

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If I wanted to produce a Holly arrowhead - meaning I'd need descendants of a CB female(there are just 7 CB f known to exist:() and a CB male, which generation I could potentially be most likely to get both for? And what more or less I could trade to get these?

That's really hard to answer. Low Gens is a problem because like I have said and like harlequinraven said this is super iffy.

 

Higher Gens can be anything from gift to rares, it's just not easy to tell you a difinite answer to this. High Gen Hollies are not really worth that much anymore because there are more in the market.

 

To an extent Hollies are a lot like Tinsels: in 2009 when I got my Holly even messy and high gens went for CB Metallics just because people wanted to get ahold of one sooooooooo badly. Now Most people won't even look at trades with Hollies higher than Gen 3-4 if anything really valuable is the other side of the deal.

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In my opinion, maybe a low rare like a CB Unbreedable. Normally when I get fails like a Blusang from Ariella's Melody I just drop it into the Departures thread or the AP and it gets picked up fairly quickly.

 

Its makes a good mate for someone looking for that exact mate, though. Its worth a try

 

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How many CB Halloween hatchlings do you think would be reasonable to ask for a 2nd gen bronze Tinsel? (lets say with an uncommon mate)

 

Thank you guys for the replies. I'll definitely take it on board. smile.gif

Edited by tishavara

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How many CB Halloween hatchlings do you think would be reasonable to ask for a 2nd gen bronze Tinsel? (lets say with an uncommon mate)

 

Any help would be appreciated I'm really bad at determining rarity.

Hard to say really.

 

Personally I'd be realistic. Look at what people can catch and possibly allow for a few to be traded for additionally.

 

I'd be a bit suspicious of too high numbers. Not that I want to like incriminate anyone but events like Halloween are temptation for multiscrolling. Again this is not intended to incriminate people with high numbers, but if I want to be 100% sure the end I recieved was obtained 100% legitimate I'd rather not go overboard too much.

 

But to be honest, also the value of Gen 2 Prizes has a limit.

Edited by Nalyua

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So, the value of CB Spessartines has gone down lately. Do you think I could get an IOU for halloween hatchlings from 2012-2014 for one? If so, how many? What kinds of things are CB Spessartines trading for these days, anyway?

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So, the value of CB Spessartines has gone down lately. Do you think I could get an IOU for halloween hatchlings from 2012-2014 for one? If so, how many? What kinds of things are CB Spessartines trading for these days, anyway?

Honestly if you were willing to take eggs you could probably get them largely for free. There are many people gifting them especially also in the IRC chatroom.

 

Not so sure what hatchies go for in any instance in this case you are paying not only for the lineage but also the scroll space for hatching.

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What is this worth?

Probably not a huge amount unless someone is specifically looking for that lineage. I drop 3rd gen prize fails (trio/blusang tier rares) in the departures thread, and while they do always go, they aren't snapped up even as fast as long gen prizes are.

 

How many CB Halloween hatchlings do you think would be reasonable to ask for a 2nd gen bronze Tinsel? (lets say with an uncommon mate)

 

Any help would be appreciated I'm really bad at determining rarity.

I, personally, would not trade a 2nd gen for Halloween hatchies, even though I do want them.

 

However, if I were to trade a 2nd gen, I would be most easily convinced if someone wanted a rarer mate (makes getting a prize easier instead of several fails, as I even had several fails with magmas, which are rares), I would want to hatchies to be close to growing up when I got them, and I would certainly not go for less than 7 (the maximum eggs a person could catch and raise).

 

My reasoning is that it is usually much easier to trade for hatchies AFTERWARD when people already have them than it is to line up IOUs. I may not even LIKE the new release enough to want to trade a 2nd gen. For a third gen prize or a CB copper/silver, I would be willing to risk not liking the release as much.

 

Now, obviously I am only one person, but this seems like nebulous territory because likely not a lot of people are trading 2Gs for Halloweens. I figured I would weigh in to give you some idea, at least.

Edited by harlequinraven

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On the other hand, you need to keep in mind that someone offering all their CB Halloweens plus trades one means that this person must take the risk of getting none for themself.

 

Personally I would actually not take this risk for a Gen 2.

 

So this is really not an easy question. Offering 2-3 CB hatchies, and honestly I would not really offer more for one personally simply because getting CB events IS a one timer, for a Gen 3 and keeping some is easier done than offering more than the own catching capacity and risking not being able to keep some.

Edited by Nalyua

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On the other hand, you need to keep in mind that someone offering all their CB Halloweens plus trades one means that this person must take the risk of getting none for themself.

 

Personally I would actually not take this risk for a Gen 2.

 

So this is really not an easy question. Offering 2-3 CB hatchies, and honestly I would not really offer more for one personally simply because getting CB events IS a one timer, for a Gen 3 and keeping some is easier done than offering more than the own catching capacity and risking not being able to keep some.

I do agree with that. I would happily take a couple hatchies for a 3rd gen. Also, as I mentioned, I think 7 hatchies would be fair (which is the max a person could raise without trades) for someone who is willing to take that risk. This negates some of the chance of not getting any for themselves, especially if they know they are good at trading for them. Considering that some people get 100 Halloweens in a single year (holy cow!), they are clearly not THAT hard to trade for. I'm sure some of those are IOUs on the part of the person receiving the hatchies (i.e. they owe the other person something to be bred), but still.

 

I would not likely trade a 2nd gen for just freshly hatched halloweens, though, unless they had a pretty big batch to offer (i.e. after they already started hatching and they had more than the 7). For an IOU, I would rather have someone offer me some Halloween hatchies plus some other things (gold/neglected/silvers/several mates I need). Then I don't risk getting nothing but sprites I am not too interested in, they don't risk getting no Halloweens, and everyone is happy. When you consider that prizes are often butts about breeding (I've been on no egg save for one magma prizefail since August, despite changing up mates and even waiting an extra day to breed) and an uncommon is likely to give several fails before you get a prize, you could be looking at months of tying up your prize. All for sprites you may or may not actually end up liking.

 

Meanwhile, once the eggs actually start hatching, it'll be easier to do trades for a couple hatchlings here and there with 3rd gens, CB metals, etc. You can very likely get more hatchlings by trading the second gen for some CB metals, then trading the metals for Halloween hatchlings. wink.gif

 

It's really a matter of something known to be extremely high value and well-liked versus something no one knows whether or not they are going to like.

 

Certainly some prize owners might be willing to trade a 2nd gen for an IOU Halloween hatchlings, but I wouldn't bet on it being a low number, especially prior to the actual release when the community has somewhat of an idea what they might be like.

 

I think, honestly, it might be easier for the OP to raise the eggs to hatchlings and then offer them in exchange for a 2G prize. smile.gif I also know it would depend on how low time the hatchlings are. I would be much more likely to trade a 2G bronze (in fact, probably would), for hatchlings that are either able to grow up with enough views or just need a few more hours (opening up space for more) than I would for freshly hatched ones. My original opinion on the matter is assuming freshly hatched, which means taking up scroll space for several days.

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I do agree with that. I would happily take a couple hatchies for a 3rd gen. Also, as I mentioned, I think 7 hatchies would be fair (which is the max a person could raise without trades) for someone who is willing to take that risk. This negates some of the chance of not getting any for themselves, especially if they know they are good at trading for them. Considering that some people get 100 Halloweens in a single year (holy cow!), they are clearly not THAT hard to trade for. I'm sure some of those are IOUs on the part of the person receiving the hatchies (i.e. they owe the other person something to be bred), but still.

 

I would not likely trade a 2nd gen for just freshly hatched halloweens, though, unless they had a pretty big batch to offer (i.e. after they already started hatching and they had more than the 7). For an IOU, I would rather have someone offer me some Halloween hatchies plus some other things (gold/neglected/silvers/several mates I need). Then I don't risk getting nothing but sprites I am not too interested in, they don't risk getting no Halloweens, and everyone is happy. When you consider that prizes are often butts about breeding (I've been on no egg save for one magma prizefail since August, despite changing up mates and even waiting an extra day to breed) and an uncommon is likely to give several fails before you get a prize, you could be looking at months of tying up your prize. All for sprites you may or may not actually end up liking.

 

Meanwhile, once the eggs actually start hatching, it'll be easier to do trades for a couple hatchlings here and there with 3rd gens, CB metals, etc. You can very likely get more hatchlings by trading the second gen for some CB metals, then trading the metals for Halloween hatchlings. wink.gif

 

It's really a matter of something known to be extremely high value and well-liked versus something no one knows whether or not they are going to like.

 

Certainly some prize owners might be willing to trade a 2nd gen for an IOU Halloween hatchlings, but I wouldn't bet on it being a low number, especially prior to the actual release when the community has somewhat of an idea what they might be like.

 

I think, honestly, it might be easier for the OP to raise the eggs to hatchlings and then offer them in exchange for a 2G prize. smile.gif I also know it would depend on how low time the hatchlings are. I would be much more likely to trade a 2G bronze (in fact, probably would), for hatchlings that are either able to grow up with enough views or just need a few more hours (opening up space for more) than I would for freshly hatched ones. My original opinion on the matter is assuming freshly hatched, which means taking up scroll space for several days.

I agree with you, I was merely playing agent provokateur.

 

The risk of not getting own CBs is one part, but for the fun of it assume someone offers twenty.

 

Where do they come from? Can I be sure they were caught from a non Multi scroll? It's also an issue!

 

Even if the person offering twenty got them in legitimate trades but what about before they came to that person? Another reason why I caution against high number rare trades.

Edited by Nalyua

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I agree with you, I was merely playing agent provokateur.

 

The risk of not getting own CBs is one part, but for the fun of it assume someone offers twenty.

 

Where do they come from? Can I be sure they were caught from a non Multi scroll? It's also an issue!

I certainly would not take an IOU for more than 7, no, both because of possible multi-scrolling and because they might not be able to keep it. The only time I would consider it if I knew the person was good at trading for Halloween hatchlings based on seeing them do so in previous years (which would require me remembering, and that is a no go! HA!).

 

I think an IOU of 6-7 low time hatchies would be fair, and it is something I might actually do (if they were very low time). The OP did not specify the age of the hatchlings, so I went with freshly hatched ones in my assessment of how likely the trade would be to get. If they are offering ones ready to grow up with more views, that's worth something. That's a fair amount of time spent raising them, plus counting they are limited time release, plus not locking your scroll for any time at all so you have room to keep accepting more in trade. wink.gif

 

So if the OP is still reading our back and forth discussion, I think there is your answer. blink.gif

 

As far as high numbers, again, I would not accept as an IOU. If someone offers me them already hatched and ready, and I see no evidence of multi-scrolling, I would accept it. I can't monitor every single transaction that happened. I will leave multiscrollers to TJ and the mods to deal with. If I personally see something I think is suspicious, of course I will report it, but if there's no reason to believe it is not legit, I'm not going to assume the worst. I've had people assume the worst about me before because I have a lot of CB metals (even before I had a prize), but I'm just a fast clicker with a lot of patience (and an extremely good eye for coppers and silvers, apparently!)

Edited by harlequinraven

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Yes I most certainly agree with you! Also the discussion was interesting, so thanks smile.gif

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What could I trade for a 2G avatar tinsel fail or alt baby?

Alt baby, as in 2nd gen from a spriter alt? Those are worth a pretty high amount. I usually trade two for a 2G prize (though that is for ones specifically of my choice, so it might be a bit less if you're offering a pre-bred one).

 

The same is true of 2G prizefails. They are worth more if you are breeding specifically what someone wants, less if you just have a random one. Still, they are hardly worthless. Common fails are worth less. I would put Avatar fails in the same category as trio fails, which I can usually get at least a CB green copper for. Sometimes more if it is what people are looking for.

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Alt baby, as in 2nd gen from a spriter alt? Those are worth a pretty high amount. I usually trade two for a 2G prize (though that is for ones specifically of my choice, so it might be a bit less if you're offering a pre-bred one).

 

The same is true of 2G prizefails. They are worth more if you are breeding specifically what someone wants, less if you just have a random one. Still, they are hardly worthless. Common fails are worth less. I would put Avatar fails in the same category as trio fails, which I can usually get at least a CB green copper for. Sometimes more if it is what people are looking for.

I would like to add that these fails as rare as they themself may be have no whatsoever reproduction value on their own.

 

So the people recieving them cannot use them for further trading mostly. Unless for specifically planned projects like my http://dragcave.net/lineage/aWiOz or http://dragcave.net/lineage/SwY9H or http://dragcave.net/lineage/4vmVD

 

So I wouldn't go overboard too much with these. At the end of they day they remain whatever breed they are and not a prize or alt themself.

 

I'm not saying that they are worthless, but I have seen it too often that people try to milk profit out of "fails" as if it were a prize (unreasonable demands such as CB metallics, as in plural, or laughing at me as I say I cannot offer a different Gen 2 fail in return out of a lack of option to breed one, and NO a blood swap is not unreasonable but the way this trader treated me was). And I have been on the recieving side of such in my eyes silly demands with no small amount of frustration as I was trying to find mates for my Gen 2 Prizes.

 

So I would caution against overdoing it in trades.

 

CB Copper or Xeno seems fair to me though.

Edited by Nalyua

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Maybe. Depends on how the person in question values those two. Spessies have become much less rare recently, but the market for Xenos has really cooled since, extreme popularity aside, they drop pretty readily. So they're both once-hot properties that have now cooled a bit. Worth a shot.

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Maybe. Depends on how the person in question values those two. Spessies have become much less rare recently, but the market for Xenos has really cooled since, extreme popularity aside, they drop pretty readily. So they're both once-hot properties that have now cooled a bit. Worth a shot.

Alright, thank you! Hopefully someone has a Pyro laying around.

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What is the current wanted color in gemshards?? What could I expect to get for a CB hatchie?

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I would like to add that these fails as rare as they themself may be have no whatsoever reproduction value on their own.

 

So the people recieving them cannot use them for further trading mostly. Unless for specifically planned projects like my http://dragcave.net/lineage/aWiOz or http://dragcave.net/lineage/SwY9H or http://dragcave.net/lineage/4vmVD

 

So I wouldn't go overboard too much with these. At the end of they day they remain whatever breed they are and not a prize or alt themself.

 

I'm not saying that they are worthless, but I have seen it too often that people try to milk profit out of "fails" as if it were a prize (unreasonable demands such as CB metallics, as in plural, or laughing at me as I say I cannot offer a different Gen 2 fail in return out of a lack of option to breed one, and NO a blood swap is not unreasonable but the way this trader treated me was). And I have been on the recieving side of such in my eyes silly demands with no small amount of frustration as I was trying to find mates for my Gen 2 Prizes.

 

So I would caution against overdoing it in trades.

 

CB Copper or Xeno seems fair to me though.

This is true, and it is why I clarified that they are worth more if you specifically breed what the person wants. smile.gif A random prizefail in trying to get a prize is not worth nearly as much as is one that is specifically bred to be a fail (i.e. intentionally taking up a breeding). The later is usually used in either specific prizefail lineages or in prize checkers. I am happy to accept a copper for a random prizefail (though I usually try to trade for another male bronze tinsel fail so I can breed the prize for a checker later...), but if someone specifically wants a certain fail from me, I'm going to ask for more because that means I have to tie up a breeding which could be used to try to produce prizes for myself or for trading.

Edited by harlequinraven

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This is true, and it is why I clarified that they are worth more if you specifically breed what the person wants. smile.gif A random prizefail in trying to get a prize is not worth nearly as much as is one that is specifically bred to be a fail (i.e. intentionally taking up a breeding). The later is usually used in either specific prizefail lineages or in prize checkers. I am happy to accept a copper for a random prizefail (though I usually try to trade for another male bronze tinsel fail so I can breed the prize for a checker later...), but if someone specifically wants a certain fail from me, I'm going to ask for more because that means I have to tie up a breeding which could be used to try to produce prizes for myself or for trading.

Yeah but even then I personally wouldn't value Common Prize fails too much.

 

I mean if you say you accept a CB Copper for a random one what would you like for a non-random one?

 

Due to really awesomely nice prize owners I got almost all of mine for free and I snagged the Valentine Prize Kin off the AP so I am kinda out of the picture.

 

But I remember how frustrated I was when all the owners wanted to accept was a CB Gold or an ND or the like for a random prize fail they were trying to trade. Which I think is entirely too much. And I sat like a year trying to find someone who was willing to trade me just about ANY prize fail, never mind the breed of the mate. At some point I just gave up getting one because the people I saw were asking the same as if it was a prize.

 

Also I'm not sure why you can't use that slot for prize trading. The one requesting a fail would want a Prize-Kin right? So you could still trade a resulting prize somewhere else could you not? Or one could place the requester when you arrange for a trade for the breed this person asked for.

 

Now I don't have a CB Prize, but when someone wanted a fail from a breeding of mine I just traded off any resulting prizes till I got their fail.

 

I know I tend to value them a little bit less than a lot of other people but after like a year of being laughed at or declined for not offering CB metallics I kinda stopped being like OMG I want one really bad. I'm really glad that I was able to recieve those that I have though and some are used to make really pretty Third Gen Tinsels at this point smile.gif

 

The only problem I see with only allowing for fail swaps is that it may be kinda hard for the general population to fullfill despite being perfectly fair of course, which is how all the "Only special people can trade for gen 2 be it prize or not" thing came in rants I have seen (and I have seen the same for Hollies when they were first rebred in 2009 and 2010).

 

Second Gen Trading is kinda an iffy topic I guess?

Edited by Nalyua

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