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2 hours ago, purplehaze said:

Sadly that is basically what the mobs are planning. They are no longer especially pro-Trump. They are anti-government.

It is a very scary time for our country.

I guess it is over time that guns get properly regulated in the US.

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I hope to god Biden can achieve that. The numbers were stacked against Obama.

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1 hour ago, Astreya said:

I guess it is over time that guns get properly regulated in the US.

good luck with that.  a lot of americans love their guns and second amendment rights.

oh, and the NRA has filed for bankruptcy, and they're moving to texas:  "as a Texas nonprofit in a move it is calling "Project Freedom," according to a statement published Friday."

yikes

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@trystan

If there is really more armed uproar in the coming times, this could be used to set into motion new legislation about gun control. Particularly right now as the NRA is a bit scant of money and can't bribe as many legislators as usual.

 

Edited by Astreya

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2 minutes ago, Astreya said:

If there is really more armed uproar in the coming times, this could be used to set into motion new legislation about gun control. Particularly right now as the NRA is a bit scant of money and can't bribe as many legislators as usual.

i really hope so.  people don't need automatic assault weapons for "self-defense"

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2 hours ago, Astreya said:

I guess it is over time that guns get properly regulated in the US.

WAY over time, but I'm not sure it is even possible. And people have been buying up guns like crazy for fear of a Biden administration that would try to shut them down. They don't even want what I call the real "weapons of mass destruction" limited. No one should limit them in any way! They have their "rights" you know!

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16 minutes ago, purplehaze said:

They have their "rights" you know!

this exactly.  regulating guns infringes on their second amendment rights! /sarcasm

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1 minute ago, trystan said:

regulating guns infringes on their second amendment rights!

Hence there needs to be an amendment to the amendment ^^

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@trystan

Obviously this needs to be set up carefully and long-term then, with a lot of lobbying going on behind the lines. But other than with getting rid of this Second Amendment, you wouldn't have a proper legal case.

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@Astreya

i agree!

 

so the second amendment, in all it's awkward 18th-century english, says:

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

 

most people just go with the last part - "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."  neverminding that the "well regulated Militia" is (IMO) the armed forces. 

 

so yes, an amendment clarifying gun rights would need to be well thought-out and perfect so that it would appeal to everyone - including those numbnuts who think they're already a militia and not just compensating for ..... things. XD 

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IMO the "militia" mentioned there should be more like the US National Guard - not really military, but still a proper organisation with rules and everything. I've read before that the 2nd amendment interpretation of the gun nuts was a bit too much into what they want to read into it, not what the original spirit of it intended.

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It was also written at a time when the only arms you could bear were slow-loading muskets, not semi-automatic weapons.

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2 minutes ago, Astreya said:

I've read before that the 2nd amendment interpretation of the gun nuts was a bit too much into what they want to read into it, not what the original spirit of it intended.

the gun nuts are good at reading too much into this amendment, that's for sure.

 

edit - also correct, Lagie.  none of the automatic weapons we have these days

 

Edited by trystan

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33 minutes ago, Astreya said:

IMO the "militia" mentioned there should be more like the US National Guard - not really military, but still a proper organisation with rules and everything. I've read before that the 2nd amendment interpretation of the gun nuts was a bit too much into what they want to read into it, not what the original spirit of it intended.

There is actually quite a bit of debate about just how it should be interpreted and what the intent was.

I found this site kind of interesting: https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/amendment/amendment-ii

 

Still, I feel it was never meant to allow every Tom, Dick, and Harry to own as many of any kind of gun as they wish, without being required to register them or anything. (Because if we register them, you know that soon "they" will be coming for our guns!)

Edited by purplehaze

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On 1/14/2021 at 5:17 PM, Nine said:

Or were they "fiery but mostly peaceful" protests, lol.

I agree that that was a ridiculous phrasing of the situation. A riot is a riot, regardless of the ideology behind it and whether or not the person referring to it agrees with it or not. And BIPOC stands for Black/Indigenous People of Color. The "BI" is mostly to highlight the special relationship Black and Native Americans have with the USA, as opposed to other minorities like Asians and Latinos.

 

On 1/14/2021 at 5:17 PM, Nine said:

The source you quoted even says the first real U.S police forces were founded to protect shipments. But yes, because the U.S once had legal slavery, the ghosts of hundred year old Southern dead men still rule modern police practices.

Yes, real forces. Slave catching posses and nightwatches were unregulated and unofficial. But no new institution is entirely divorced from the one that preceded it-- the official forces emerged from the early ones. The 13 colonies became the 13 states. Ghosts from the 1700s don't run our government but we still follow the Constitution. The Civil War was lost in the 1800s but we still have people waving Confederate flags today.

 

On 1/14/2021 at 5:17 PM, Nine said:

I don't know who the Roof guy is, I don't care to keep track of murderers' names. Comparing every situation to each other is opening a can of worms because each situation is so completely unique, and certain examples of injustice should not facilitate injustice for everyone.

 

Dylann Roof was a mass shooter from South Carolina who shot 9 people in a church back in 2015. His jailhouse manifesto mentioned doing so in the hopes of starting a race war.

 

Did a deeper dive on Taylor's case and you were right that she was awake and the police did arrive at the right residence, though she wasn't the main target of the police and her death was entirely accidental. The controversy comes from the no-knock warrant the police had, as well as their reaction to Kenneth Walker's single shot. You are right that I did see misinformation about the circumstances of her death and believed it. I don't like the insinuation that I think it's a coverup for something "bigger", however, and honestly many other assumptions you've made about my beliefs are a bit hurtful. It's a backhanded way of expressing disagreement and it's putting words in my mouth. I do care about finding fair and accurate sources for my news, I am willing to acknowledge my own bias and think critically about my ideology, and I don't think you're "weird and crazy" at all.

 

Thank you for providing these sources. I'm going to be looking at them, I do promise that, though I can't promise that I'll agree with them (I personally avoid the Manhattan Institute). I, personally, am quite political, mostly because I have no choice but to be. Being a transgender person of color means not being the "default" in the USA, and seeing white nationalists wanting to expunge me and my family from this country on account of what I am is obviously quite uncomfortable. My parents' home country has been subject to a lot of dictators over the years and I'd hate to see America turn to authoritarianism. So I do feel compelled to engage in politics, for my own sake and in solidarity with others like me. I don't know what your personal life is like, and that's obviously your business, but if my beliefs of anti-authoritarian-far-left come from my life circumstances, your own beliefs of (what I assume are) center-but-leaning-right emerge from your own unique circumstances and perspectives, too.

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On 1/14/2021 at 5:17 PM, Nine said:

I hesitate to say this in this thread, but as someone who is completely non-political I can also pretty confidently say not everyone who voted for Trump is an evil monster who has a subscription to KKK-magazine monthly.

See... here's the problem with this:

 

What would be your stance if, say, you knew someone who was personally verbally abused and harassed by a toxic individual that shared the same social circle as their victim? And, let's say that social circle decided to support the toxic individual because, while they didn't fully agree with that toxic behavior, they were willing to overlook it for the sake of this toxic individual's future potential? Because, I mean, aside from the verbally abusive language/behavior, they're a pretty good person. Right?

 

You don't have to be part of the KKK or another white supremacist group to be a Trump voter. But if the people who voted for him were willing to ignore his toxic and abusive behavior because of some "oh but surely he's a good guy, otherwise"? What do you think that says to those around them who are negatively impacted by such abuse? It says to those impacted that they aren't truly safe around those who voted to ignore abusive behavior. It says to them that they're seen as less-than by those that voted for Trump. Verbal escalates to physical. Trump continuously advocated for and incited violence. One example, of many.

 

Complacency is just as bad as committing the abuse. Complacency is condoning the behavior. It's how abusers get away with repeated abuse. Because of the complacency and condoning of bystanders. Heck, even the support from bystanders as they continue to fail in holding abusers accountable for their actions. Abusers face no consequences, only validation and reward. 

 

You may be non-political. That is your privilege. But as soullessheartofsteal mentioned, there are millions of individuals who do not get that privilege to be non-political. Our very bodies are politicized by White Supremacy and the US Government. Our identities are weaponized against us, used as justification for abusing and killing us. We have to always be political because, otherwise, our rights are suppressed and our right to life is threatened.

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4 hours ago, ValidEmotions said:

You may be non-political. That is your privilege. But as soullessheartofsteal mentioned, there are millions of individuals who do not get that privilege to be non-political. Our very bodies are politicized by White Supremacy and the US Government. Our identities are weaponized against us, used as justification for abusing and killing us. We have to always be political because, otherwise, our rights are suppressed and our right to life is threatened.

 

As someone else (not on DC) said, "That's what they believe strength is: a hatred for weakness." Except the 'weakness' they hate is often your identity or your body. 

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Well, just a few more days, and our new president will be inaugurated. I'm so excited! All the illegal aliens that come from South America will be here! And with our new open door policy that will be signed in to effect his first day in office, we won't have to wait very long for new friends and neighbors! From the news, they showed riots on the border of South America and Mexico. That's so sad. Especially when many of those future Americans have urgent medical conditions that need a lot of free medical care. We have to get them all started with food, housing, and as I said, medical care. Then, I bet we will have a lot of babies coming by Christmas time lol! I know if it was me, I would want this new freedom. I wouldn't give consideration to the American people. And that is and will be tragic. 

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Since you didn't provide sources to back up your other claims when requested, Suzan, what are the chances you'll bring sources for this set of claims? Probably zero 😕

 

Also, given your similar behavior in this thread before, I'm honestly not confident that you're here for more than to just troll or be awful or something else that's in rather bad faith. But I'll indulge, just in case:

 

Immigrants, especially those with brown skin who are the most singled out because White people are always forgetting about immigrants from Canada and Europe, make up the majority of farm labor and essential work that many US-born citizens don't want to work because they think it's beneath them. Illegal immigrants don't receive any benefits: no wellfare, no health insurance, no social security. Nothing. Despite this, they pay the most in taxes. And guess what? The majority wait years for citizenship, which the application requires you to be a permanent resident in the states. A green card, similarly, often takes several years. They pay for citizenship in a good several hundred dollars per person. 

Facts to debunk the myths of immigration and illegal immigrants

 

Let's not forget the fact that part of the application is a test on US government and history they have to pass that a vast majority of US-born citizens wouldn't pass, themselves.

 

Biden and Harris aren't making an "open door" 🙄 They're reforming the entire thing so that immigrants can actually have a path to citizenship instead of being left to wait for decades and spend thousands of dollars when the process does everything it can to deny then without saying "no, here's why". Because, right now, the process tells them "ehhh we'll get to you eventually. Until then, keep paying us".

Politico on Immigration reform by Biden

 

Also, quick addition: not every brown-skinned individual/family is from Mexico or South America. Other Latin American countries exist. There's an entire Central American continent filled with several countries. Thank you. There's also the fact that non-white people live in Canada and Europe, too. 

 

White People were illegal first

These are your illegals that pillaged and raped and slaughtered the indigenous. These are your criminals that came to another land with the purpose of stealing it. Not Mexicans. Not Latinos. White people.

Edited by ValidEmotions

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Applauds Valid - we don't always agree, but Suzan - your post appalled me.

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As one indigenous person, me, would like to point out, no one is illegal on stolen land!

Edited by Pinch of StarDust

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I'm sure that Suzan is stating what she has been told are facts, but I am afraid they are some of the Trump world's "alternate facts". The same sort of facts that white supremacists have always cited in trying to demonize the "other".

Edited by purplehaze

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@Suzan

Out of curiosity - would you say this is a "legal US person" or an "illegal alien"?

Xray.jpg

Edited by Astreya

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