Abortion

[7Deadly$ins]

Wikipedia isn't a great source, but it still doesn't prove how most unwanted children end up crimially minded.

 

I'm pro-choice, but I'm also pro-critical thinking and I'm not the type to accept others' arguments on blind faith.

[JOTB]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article....e-on-personhood

Relevant?

[diannethegeek]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article....e-on-personhood

Relevant?

I'm so glad that thing failed, but really disappointed that only 55% of voters voted against it.

[Brite]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article....e-on-personhood

Relevant?

Oh god. What happens to their personhood if the egg was reabsorbed by the woman's body? They throw her in jail?

[Dr. Paine]

Oh god. What happens to their personhood if the egg was reabsorbed by the woman's body? They throw her in jail?

I wonder if they'd count it as cannibalism ._.

[hazeh]

I wonder if they'd count it as cannibalism ._.

Involuntary Manslaughter, i think :U Though cannibalism makes sense (in regards to the bill...)

[Brite]

Seems that common sense is just too hard to find these days..

[xhunter]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article....e-on-personhood

Relevant?

other american really gets under my skin. they try to define everything on only one factor.

 

life can't be based on only one factor like that. that is why these things interfere with each other when it comes to these things. eggs should not be considered with human rights till they born. silly really, they would take the rights of the female that carry the egg and give it to some clump of cells. i presonaly think they should not 'redefine person hood.' its too funny that they would take the rights of a person that becomes a vegetable though give a few cells rights when they know less that the others.

[Brite]

other american really gets under my skin. they try to define everything on only one factor.

 

life can't be based on only one factor like that. that is why these things interfere with each other when it comes to these things. eggs should not be considered with human rights till they born. silly really, they would take the rights of the female that carry the egg and give it to some clump of cells. i presonaly think they should not 'redefine person hood.' its too funny that they would take the rights of a person that becomes a vegetable though give a few cells rights when they know less that the others.

I'm tired of the whole thing about "life is good, life is great, we protect the unborn!" but once they ARE born, they don't give a about them or what happens to them. I only respect REAL pro-lifers that try helping not only the fetus but the woman as well and even if she does get an abortion, they don't demonize her but still comfort her. Now it's all, "How could you kill your baby?! Your own offspring?! You're a monster that will burn!"

 

Really, do you want to take care of it for me? No? Then butt the hell out.

[xhunter]

I'm tired of the whole thing about "life is good, life is great, we protect the unborn!" but once they ARE born, they don't give a about them or what happens to them. I only respect REAL pro-lifers that try helping not only the fetus but the woman as well and even if she does get an abortion, they don't demonize her but still comfort her. Now it's all, "How could you kill your baby?! Your own offspring?! You're a monster that will burn!"

 

Really, do you want to take care of it for me? No? Then butt the hell out.

i know what you mean i could not have put it in better words myself.

 

if they wanted the offspring so bad they should care for them themselves or adopt one. i guess though it all goes back to ego and ignoring the truth. personly i don't think that they care more than save face. though i can't really see there main point on opposing abortion.

[Trikonasana]

I'm tired of the whole thing about "life is good, life is great, we protect the unborn!" but once they ARE born, they don't give a about them or what happens to them. I only respect REAL pro-lifers that try helping not only the fetus but the woman as well and even if she does get an abortion, they don't demonize her but still comfort her. Now it's all, "How could you kill your baby?! Your own offspring?! You're a monster that will burn!"

 

Really, do you want to take care of it for me? No? Then butt the hell out.

Basically my thoughts on this.

[Red Dragonette]

It's good to see that we have some pro-choicers, especially well-spoken ones like Ghostchilli her, on the forums. But it's too bad that we've got a growing number of pro-lifers in America. At this rate, we might have abortion banned in all states as well as an increase in homelessness and maybe criminals (both of whom are thw unwanted children). And I'll tell you why that might be.

 

Homelessness - If the unwanted child is born to a low income woman, then when all the money she's earned gets spent on taking care of the baby, she'll go bankrupt and will. Have to sell her home to go live out on the streets. Thus the child will grow up to be a homeless bum while having poor education and little to no welfare.

 

Criminals - Unwanted children are often neglected and abused. Children treated badly often grow up to be delinquients and lawbreakers.

 

This is not the kind of life I want for fetuses everywhere. That's why abortion is a must, if you don't plan on raising children.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Red Dragonette

[Brite]

It's good to see that we have some pro-choicers, especially well-spoken ones like Ghostchilli her, on the forums. But it's too bad that we've got a growing number of pro-lifers in America. At this rate, we might have abortion banned in all states as well as an increase in homelessness and maybe criminals (both of whom are thw unwanted children). And I'll tell you why that might be.

 

Actually I'm not that great of a speaker. The better ones haven't been on.

 

This is not the kind of life I want for fetuses everywhere. That's why abortion is a must, if you don't plan on raising children. 

 

Here's the thing, politics and naive people choose to ignore that and take no excuse and believe there's a land of plenty when there's really not. It seems they're trying to use twisted religion to get what they want, even though this country isn't suppose to be christian, much less than it's suppose to be muslim, or buddhism. I just hope that never changes, we don't need to live on biased ideas.

[xhunter]

It's good to see that we have some pro-choicers, especially well-spoken ones like Ghostchilli her, on the forums. But it's too bad that we've got a growing number of pro-lifers in America. At this rate, we might have abortion banned in all states as well as an increase in homelessness and maybe criminals (both of whom are thw unwanted children). And I'll tell you why that might be.

 

Homelessness - If the unwanted child is born to a low income woman, then when all the money she's earned gets spent on taking care of the baby, she'll go bankrupt and will. Have to sell her home to go live out on the streets. Thus the child will grow up to be a homeless bum while having poor education and little to no welfare.

the number of pro-lifers will fall one day, though it might be too late. i would say i would laugh in there faces when that happens but there would be too many dead women or bad overpopulation that crashes the gov.

 

homelessness by not being able to support a child is small part of it. likely in america tax paying money will go to try and support them and the child, i heard once from someone at my mom's work that this teen, the person, got around 1300 in food stamps to feed her and her child, only two people mind you, a month.

 

some families that have food stamps and have more people, 3 or more, seem to only get 500, if there lucky, and lower. they can't tell us that two people, a mother plus one small child, that tiny can eat more than a family of people with 4 or more. thought some people miss use the funds and only get preg. so they can get access to these tax funds just like some people don't try and get jobs when there avalible so they can get social security. and even then some of those parents only abuse and neglect the child till needed, abuse not counted if its a small slap on the wrist thing. its people that take advantage of this stuff that takes away from those in need, note it is hard to get a job and people fresh out of high school have close to no chance because of no college degrees and all and i respect that. i do not respect when they go years without trying and not even putting in a few job apps.

 

but you might get the homelessness from when the child becomes of age and they can't get no more help and some of those that can't get a job leech off the mother (and sometimes the father if there is one supporting the child) and making them file bankrupt. so its more likely that a the fetus to be will get to a age and the part files bankrupt and becomes homeless and even then some of these people have to move in with friends or family to try and prevent this. in america its to the point that you can't keep a home unless you get two incomes. but yes i see your point and its a good point for later on in their lives.

 

yes there are homes in america that go years without being bought though can you really blame anyone for not buying and sometimes you have to look at number of rooms and all as well as price. most homes at the lowest are 190,000 or so and not counting the ones that are 600,000 and have dropped prices because of no buyers. most people would have to pay 500 and so dollars a month for one close to 190,000 or so, yes i looked threw a few sights selling homes and my mom helped me get the formula on predicting rent to buy prices. (chip in if you have a better ex.)

 

but yes abortion will be a major problem once it is banned because these ex. will become even worse in my thought.

though anyone can become criminals though that is how they survive, though note i'm note counting killers, because they have to steal to make a living. i'm not shore if this is a firm answer though i predict that most orphaned and poor family children are more likely to steal than any other crime.

 

but yes sadly in america abortion might become banned though i think that personalty that pro-lifes should not have a say unless they have adopted at lest one child or any race or handicapped and not just the perfect little bundle because no matter the sex, race, or family history it is not influenced for misbehavior by these its the staying in the orphanages being neglected because of over populations. behavior comes from the subjects surrounding and how they adapt.

 

but GhostChilli is right politics and naive people, mostly for the politics its the very religious that push these matters as well as others. and as many of use know both religion and politics should not mixes especially in america where it is supposed to be a free country and free of religions prosecution. but is those that push for there agenda using there religion that makes pro-choices people have to fear the ignorance and having there rights removed in these cases. no offence to those christains here that don't miss use its rights but i think that its the people that only claim the rights of a religion and don't have it that have stabbed there G-d in the Heart and killed him/her themselves, though what do they matter if they drive true believes of the faith G-ds into the ground. the musts can't happen in a world with religion that is why politics should be separate.

 

but you have very good points.

[Red Dragonette]

the number of pro-lifers will fall one day, though it might be too late. i would say i would laugh in there faces when that happens but there would be too many dead women or bad overpopulation that crashes the gov.

Well as long as there's pro-choicers in our country, our home may never become 100% abortion-free. And it seems like I have some good points as well as some flaws in my arguments. But I am more happy about the good points I made.

 

Anyway, here's a few petitions to legalize abortion, if you want to help out: Link 1 and Link 2.

[xhunter]

Anyway, here's a few petitions to legalize abortion, if you want to help out: Link 1 and Link 2.

thanks i will go see about the petitions. a few of us here will more than likely help out with that cause.

[Kestra15]

Homelessness - If the unwanted child is born to a low income woman, then when all the money she's earned gets spent on taking care of the baby, she'll go bankrupt and will. Have to sell her home to go live out on the streets. Thus the child will grow up to be a homeless bum while having poor education and little to no welfare.

 

Criminals - Unwanted children are often neglected and abused. Children treated badly often grow up to be delinquients and lawbreakers.

Sources and statistics please.

[Red Dragonette]

Here's my source for the criminal topic: link

 

As for the homelessness idea, I'll admit that I didn't look it up on any websites or books. I just used my knowledge that I gained from Sociology about social statuses being usually inheritable (ex: rich families produce rich children because of the vast wealth to provide higher education; poor families produce poor children) and my knowledge on how raising children cost a lot of money to form that theory. Go ahead, sue me for being inaccurate, but I might be right just in case.

 

Anyway, here's another reason why I unwanted fetuses shouldn't be risked born into the world:

 

Loneliness - Unwanted children who are created by rape or one-night stands, may never get to see their father and they may be worried about who their daddy is and why he wasn't there with them. Also, should the mother happen to abandon the baby and leave him/her to adoption agencies, that child may feel unloved by his/her parents, wondered why they abandoned him/her, and think it's his/her fault. It'll be worse if no one adopts the child before they grow up into adulthood.

 

Sources: Link 1,

 

Also, someone just pointed more reasons to support legalization of abortion.

 

Sorry if my post seems messed up or flawed, but I started to get bored halfway and was running out of excellent ideas on what to say.

[Kestra15]

None of those seem credible.

[Red Dragonette]

State your reasons why, please.

[Kestra15]

State your reasons why, please.

Simple; they're stating opinions, not facts and figures from impartial sources. It's liking quoting the Bible as proof of God's existence.

[Red Dragonette]

Last night, I was looking up on google websites that show statistical relationships between abortion and crime, but only to find they showed the opposite of what I thought: abortions do increase crime rate, which happened in the 1970s - 1980s. Most of them were from Christian, conservative, and/or websites made before 2007. The intro did say that websites like those just lied to people to scare them away from abortion, so I just choose to ignore them. But then this morning I found a source that explained why the crime rates rose and that abortion didn't have anything to do with it, unfortunately, it's from Wikipedia. Just read the whole thing and then looked at the numbered sources in the Nevin section.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Impact_of...ortion_on_Crime

 

I think that might support my abortion/crime rate idea. I'll be looking for homelessness later; right now, I gotta go wash up the dishes.

 

EDIT: I think I finally found a reliable source that supports my homelessness theory: http://www.nn4youth.org/system/files/Issue...d_parenting.pdf

Edited January 7, 2012 by Red Dragonette

[7Deadly$ins]

Wikipedia cites its sources too.

 

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abs...ortion_on_Crime

[xhunter]

Also, someone just pointed more reasons to support legalization of abortion.

 

Sorry if my post seems messed up or flawed, but I started to get bored halfway and was running out of excellent ideas on what to say.

if your talking about the two people that signed it one of them was me, and they were mostly some facts as well as my personal thoughts. i was the second one to sign the petition after joining the site.

 

10% or so of it comes from proven fact and the other part of it is judgeable by anyone that thinks diff. than me.

 

you probably should not type while your bored it tends to mess up your argument, you can always state that you will add more of your thoughts later, we would understand.

 

Edited: i carried a few of those points over from my statements i made here.

Edited January 8, 2012 by xhunter

[xXTashaXx]

me myself? its hard to think about. it would be so much easier to take care of a child when your able to and not have any other priorities, most of you know this is not the case with abortions.

 

Most of the abortions are teenagers looking for a way out so that they don't have to ruin their education. There's also this other side however, which says that you cant just end a life before it even starts.

 

I guess it depends on circumstance i suppose, it really comes down to you having to ask yourself, if i was in college/high school and about to finally get my education would i really want to have to take care of a baby when I'm so close? my ideas on the subject ^-^