Abortion

[MedievalMystic]

I'm not in any way, shape, or form glamorizing teen mothers, simply stating that there are outliers to the 'teens are terrible mothers' stigma and that not all should be painted with the same brush.

 

Ok, understood. Sorry about the misunderstanding.

 

Ideally, a teenager shouldn't be in the situation to have to choose in the first place, when there's so many ways to prevent pregnancy.

 

Agreed.

Edited April 8, 2015 by MedievalMystic

[Brite]

Warning, possible bad language:

 

 

http://www.justfactsdaily.com/the-science-...does-life-begin

 

 

This killed some of my brain cells..

[BlitzDrake]

At this point I might just join the Satanic Temple/donate to them.

 

Satanic Temple Sue's Missori's For Abortion Wait Period

 

[StormBirdRising]

I'm still in favor of the morning after pill.

[Brite]

I'm still in favor of the morning after pill.

Well the difference is, it keeps an egg from being released and expel one if one has been already, but it will not get rid of an already fertilized egg. The hormones aren't strong enough. At least this if for the Plan B pill. Which I have taken before.

 

So I don't see why someone would be against the morning after pill.

 

At this point I might just join the Satanic Temple/donate to them.

 

Satanic Temple Sue's Missori's For Abortion Wait Period

 

 

Wow, though I stand up for what they're doing for rights, I do not share their beliefs. I feel people will hold this over pro-choicers heads and be like, "Lulz, see? Satan supports killing children. If you're pro-choice, you obviously worship Satan!"

Edited May 20, 2015 by GhostChilli

[Shienvien]

but it will not get rid of an already fertilized egg.

As far as I know, it can remove a fertilized egg as long as it has not implanted yet. It won't get rid of an implanted egg.

 

I feel people will hold this over pro-choicers heads and be like, "Lulz, see? Satan supports killing children. If you're pro-choice, you obviously worship Satan!"

Sadly, my thoughts went there first, too...

[Kith]

From what I understand of Plan B, all it does is delay ovulation. If an egg's already been released, it's too late for the pill to help, which is why it's suggested to take it ASAP even though it can technically still be okay 72h later (edit: or even 120, I'm seeing, though 5 days is a long time to wait).

Edited May 20, 2015 by Kith

[Dewdropmon]

I personally don't like the idea of abortion but I don't think it should be made illegal. There are cases where I would be okay with abortion (rape, pregnancy complications that endanger the mother, unable to support the child, etc.) And even without such factors, I believe it should be the woman's choice. One thing some people need to realize is that even if they are not okay with the reason for the choice, it does not affect their life unless they are directly related to the woman making the choice.

[BlitzDrake]

I hadn't thought about the "pro choicers are satanist" argument actually. Though remember, not everyone has the "christian" or (other religions that oppose abortion) "values" of the U.S. and it really isn't fair to say "you can't have one unless you wait, watch these videos to make you feel ashamed about yourself" or give other false information that is opinionated.

Looking into TST they support giving factual information about abortions, not intended to make you feel guilty or change your mind. They want people to know what the procedure is, options, etc, and fights for women's rights. And since we all have a freedom of religion in this country (or we should, and not being run by people that want to shove their beliefs onto us in the form of politics, etc), if being a "Satanist" is what it takes to have women's right to choice, because it's against their beliefs to be shown falsified information, even if I'm not religious sign me up.

Sure people can say "oh pro-choicers are Satanist", that might be insulting to some, but I myself would take pride in saying "yes, I do in fact support logical information and not having my rights oppressed". Why? Because at the heart of the pro-force argument, most tend to be religious and try to control the pro-choice side through it. So I think this is just what we need, ANOTHER religion that counters them. A religion that says "well...my religion says that I have a right NOT to _____"

 

Just like a while back in...Orlando was it (a bit off topic) that the TST decided since other religions were giving out their pamphlets, TST started to as well. What happened? The county said "No we're not dealing with this. No one is allowed to give out these anymore". Which I find fair, if you only support one religion giving out information about themselves and not letting other religions say "well this is what our beliefs are" then its just letting a single group control what people "learn".

[Obscure_Trash]

Wow, though I stand up for what they're doing for rights, I do not share their beliefs. I feel people will hold this over pro-choicers heads and be like, "Lulz, see? Satan supports killing children. If you're pro-choice, you obviously worship Satan!"

Tbh... I don't really care. So they think we're Satan worshipers? They've already come out with so much propaganda. They're going to believe what they believe. That shouldn't mean we don't get reproductive rights. Some people are Satanists. That doesn't mean they don't deserve rights.

 

(And I'm fairly certain """"sidewalk counselors"""" and anti-choice protestors already shout about Satan worshipers, so whatevs.)

[Omega Entity]

From what I understand of Plan B, all it does is delay ovulation. If an egg's already been released, it's too late for the pill to help, which is why it's suggested to take it ASAP even though it can technically still be okay 72h later (edit: or even 120, I'm seeing, though 5 days is a long time to wait).

Plan B One-Step® is one tablet with levonorgestrel, a hormone that has been used in many birth control pills for several decades. Plan B One-Step® contains a higher dose of levonorgestrel than birth control pills, but works in a similar way to prevent pregnancy. It works mainly by stopping the release of an egg from the ovary. It is possible that Plan B One-Step® may also work by preventing fertilization of an egg (the uniting of sperm with the egg) or by preventing attachment (implantation) to the uterus (womb). It should not be used as regular birth control, as it is not as effective.

 

Taken from the official website.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Omega Entity

[Kith]

Interesting... Then my source was incorrect, and it's even harder for people not to call it an "abortion pill" then, even if that's not it's main intended effect.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Kith

[Omega Entity]

Eh, IMO a person's not preggo unless the fertilized egg implants. But that just my opinion.

[Shienvien]

To my knowledge, failure to implant is something that occurs with roughly thirty percent of fertilized eggs normally, without any birth control, so considering a person pregnant before implantation is doing so a bit too early, I'd say.

[DarkLadyNyara]

Wow, though I stand up for what they're doing for rights, I do not share their beliefs. I feel people will hold this over pro-choicers heads and be like, "Lulz, see? Satan supports killing children. If you're pro-choice, you obviously worship Satan!"

They already say "if you're pro-choice, you obviously worship Satan!"

 

From what I understand of Plan B, all it does is delay ovulation. If an egg's already been released, it's too late for the pill to help, which is why it's suggested to take it ASAP even though it can technically still be okay 72h later (edit: or even 120, I'm seeing, though 5 days is a long time to wait).

 

Pretty much.

 

There was, at one point, a theory that it could prevent a fertilized egg from implanting. There was never actually any evidence of that happening, and studies done on the matter have pretty much ruled out the possibility. Unfortunately, the inaccurate information still remains in a lot of places, including the official site. Blame the FDA for being slow in catching up to the scientific consensus.

[StormBirdRising]

To my knowledge, failure to implant is something that occurs with roughly thirty percent of fertilized eggs normally, without any birth control, so considering a person pregnant before implantation is doing so a bit too early, I'd say.

If you had unprotected sex and don't want to get pregnant you should take the morning-after pill ASAP.

Once you've confirmed the pregnancy you are in a whole different ball game, and generally the only remedy is clinical abortion.

 

[Shienvien]

If you had unprotected sex and don't want to get pregnant you should take the morning-after pill ASAP.

Once you've confirmed the pregnancy you are in a whole different ball game, and generally the only remedy is clinical abortion.

Not sure how this relates to my post (I was simply speaking of when a person should "officially" be considered pregnant), but generally, yes, while there exist purely chemical methods for inducing early abortion (and most early abortions are chemical-only around here, with no surgery), these pills aren't exactly over-the-counter.

[StormBirdRising]

but generally, yes, while there exist purely chemical methods for inducing early abortion (and most early abortions are chemical-only around here, with no surgery), these pills aren't exactly over-the-counter.

 

Do you have to have a prescription for the morning after pill where you are? Where I live it is over the counter and I think anyone can purchase it (there might be a minimum age, I'm not sure, very political and they are always changing the rules).

[Shienvien]

Do you have to have a prescription for the morning after pill where you are? Where I live it is over the counter and I think anyone can purchase it (there might be a minimum age, I'm not sure, very political and they are always changing the rules).

Morning-after pill is over-the-counter. (Not sure about minimum age, may look up when I have time later.)

 

Chemical abortion pills are only issued by doctors.

[StormBirdRising]

Chemical abortion pills are only issued by doctors.

I'll be looking that one up later because I've heard of it here in the forum but I don't know much about it.

[Brite]

I have seen and used the pills used for abortions. They were interesting. I had to use it to "soften" the cervix before I had my IUD put in. They're rather powerful. There was a lot of warning labels on it. I think I would rather have the clinical abortion than use the pill version..

[nlechoppa]

http://liveactionnews.org/babies-born-aliv...-their-stories/

 

http://www.swordandspirit.com/library/prol...bryo_fetus.html

Edited July 3, 2015 by Soulking

[crazyflower]

You didn't type anything in your post so I don't really know know what you are trying to say. Are you pro-life or are you just showing us a couple of pro-life links? The first link I could not take seriously after the first sentence. I read the whole thing and it is massively misleading if not outright lying. The stories make me wonder if they were doing illegal abortions - if these stories are true at all. For example

I worked the 11 p.m. to 7 a.m. shift, and when we weren’t busy, I’d go out to help with the newborns. One night I saw a bassinet outside the nursery. There was a baby in this bassinet – a crying, perfectly formed baby – but there was a difference in this child. She had been scalded. She was the child of a saline abortion.

 

This little girl looked as if she had been put in a pot of boiling water. No doctor, no nurse, no parent, to comfort this hurt, burned child. She was left alone to die in pain. They wouldn’t let her in the nursery – they didn’t even bother to cover her.

 

I was ashamed of my profession that night! It’s hard to believe this can happen in our modern hospitals, but it does. It happens all the time. I thought a hospital was a place to heal the sick – not a place to kill.

 

I asked a nurse at another hospital what they do with their babies that are aborted by saline. Unlike my hospital, where the baby was left alone struggling for breath, their hospital puts the infant in a bucket and puts the lid on. Suffocation! Death by suffocation!

 

I am highly skeptical of this story. I think this could be 1) made up- 2) illegal abortion or 3) real event (baby born with genetic defect) that had details twisted to put an anti-abortion spin on it.

The article also refers to late term abortions. These are quite rare and only done when necessary.

[AnanoKimi]

I really only think abortion should be the choice of the woman if its a health or psychological risk at least here in the US. If teen or unwanted pregnancies are an issue then what needs to change is the sexual education of our schools. Promote absitnence as one method but encourage children that should they want to explore their sexual desires early to use condoms and be safe. Teach them about relationships that pressure you into sex, teach about the signs of rape victims and teach children not to rape. Teach children about self respect and self love because sometimes children easpecially later teens have sex because they feel unatractive and ugly and take the first person that makes them feel like they good enough to have sex with.

 

We need to teach our children the truth about sex, protection, relationships, and over all as well absitence. Abstince not in the manner of "If you have sex your penis falls off and you vagina rots!" No no no no no. Absitncence in "If you do not feel ready for sexual intercourse, are feeling pressured into it, or are simply uncomfortable by it, you don't have to do it. It doesnt matter if he has a condom, if she got tested, if the toys are clean. If you do not want to, there is no reason you have to. Sexual exploration is not a must, it is something you have the privilage to decline and not do until you feel capable and ready."

[St. Jimmy]

I really only think abortion should be the choice of the woman if its a health or psychological risk at least here in the US.

The reality of it is, there are far more reasons someone may choose an abortion (financial, time, just don't want to be pregnant/give birth, etc.) and all are valid. Nor does it matter how one got pregnant in the first place - it should be no one's business but theirs.

 

Promote absitnence as one method but encourage children that should they want to explore their sexual desires early to use condoms and be safe. Teach them about relationships that pressure you into sex, teach about the signs of rape victims and teach children not to rape. Teach children about self respect and self love because sometimes children easpecially later teens have sex because they feel unatractive and ugly and take the first person that makes them feel like they good enough to have sex with.

Abstince not in the manner of "If you have sex your penis falls off and you vagina rots!" No no no no no. Absitncence in "If you do not feel ready for sexual intercourse, are feeling pressured into it, or are simply uncomfortable by it, you don't have to do it. It doesnt matter if he has a condom, if she got tested, if the toys are clean. If you do not want to, there is no reason you have to. Sexual exploration is not a must, it is something you have the privilage to decline and not do until you feel capable and ready."

 

Now this I can agree on. Comprehensive sex education that covers all options before and after sex, is what helps prevent unwanted pregnancy and therefore abortion. And that right there is how abstinence should be taught - no one learns anything from being told "just don't do it."