Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) And what I'm saying is that, with the best will in the world, most people who care long-term will at some point question their ability to love. And thank you for being so insulting, by the way. You may not see it, but calling us 'wimps' and saying we 'do nothing' because we find life 'too hard' is quite the insult. Just because I have no interest in raising kids - and especially do not feel I could look after one with additional needs - does not make me a 'wimp;' if you would like to see what I'm capable of, feel free to come onto the Intensive Care Unit where I'm a nurse, or out into the nightclubs where I work as a medic. I apologize for coming off as insulting, I guess I did get a little worked up . I was not meaning to imply that those who didn't want children were whimps, I was only stating that people each have their challenges to meet and if mine is to take in a mentally disabled child, then I would be more than happy to face it. As stated in a previous post, my intents were merely to point out that some people do care about special needs children even if they may question it. Edited December 31, 2011 by Zephyrgirl Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 I am well aware of these problems and, no I don't blame the mothers for their situation. Most anti-abortionists that I know realize these issues and are sympathetic in dealing with it. However, there are other answers besides abortion, in my opinion. If you were well aware of the problems that exist, then you wouldn't be Pro-Birth. At all. There are several organizations run by anti-abortionists dedicated to helping mothers in various situations, not just rape. Yes, an expectant mother who doesn't want a child is going to go to an ANTI-ABORTION crowd to have a guilt trip the size of a truck shoved down their throat, made to feel like absolute crap, and walks out of there probably crying and more confused than ever. Yeah, no thank you. I'd rather go to Planned Parenthood and get an unbiased opinion. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) Yes, an expectant mother who doesn't want a child is going to go to an ANTI-ABORTION crowd to have a guilt trip the size of a truck shoved down their throat, made to feel like absolute crap, and walks out of there probably crying and more confused than ever. Yeah, no thank you. I'd rather go to Planned Parenthood and get an unbiased opinion. I don't know where you get your information from, but anti-abortionists don't just sit around rubbing their hands together and saying, "Oooh, let's see who we can force into our little schemes today." There is a reason we believe like we do, at least truly Christian anti-abortionists, and it is because we care about both mother and child. Most are giving of their money and time, unlike Planned-Parenthood and abortion clinics. I don't mean to offend you or anything, but it sounds as though you are making an assumption. Not all anti-abortionists wish to lay guilt trips on expectant mothers, certainly not the ones I know. Did you ever think that perhaps those who are pro-choice have an agenda to push as well? One involving money? Edited December 31, 2011 by Zephyrgirl Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 I don't know where you get your information from, but anti-abortionists don't just sit around rubbing their hands together and saying, "Oooh, let's see who we can force into our little schemes today." There is a reason we believe like we do, at least truly Christian anti-abortionists, and it is because we care about both mother and child. Most are giving of their money and time, unlike Planned-Parenthood and abortion clinics. I don't mean to offend you or anything, but it sounds as though you are making an assumption. Not all anti-abortionists wish to lay guilt trips on expectant mothers, certainly not the ones I know. Did you ever think that perhaps those who are pro-choice have an agenda to push as well? One involving money? Do elaborate our get rich scheme involving abortion, please. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Do elaborate our get rich scheme involving abortion, please. Money is involved in performing an abortion. Do you think that doctors just do the opperation for free? Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Money is involved in performing an abortion. Do you think that doctors just do the opperation for free? It takes money to keep up with the doctor's office/equipment. They're going to have to charge. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 It takes money to keep up with the doctor's office/equipment. They're going to have to charge. Not only that, but you're also paying the doctor for their service, just as you would for any other doctor. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 And some doctors in some clinics do do abortions for free. Where do you think young, scared pregnant girls go that can't tell their parents? The girl likely can't pay for the operation herself. And it's not like abortions are the only things those doctors are good for. It's just another necessary service available to those who need it, in a safe and sterile environment. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 It takes money to keep up with the doctor's office/equipment. They're going to have to charge. Exactly, but the doctors get a salary, too, out of performing these opperations. I'd like some more information on Planned Parenthood. Are they a non-profit organization? Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 I could have an abortion for much cheaper than MOST medical procedures if I wanted one. If abortion doctors were in it to get rich, I'm sure they wouldn't go so far to provide counseling before and afterwards, etc. Sure, every practice is different, but if they wanted to deprive people of their money, they could charge quite a bit more. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Exactly, but the doctors get a salary, too, out of performing these opperations. I'd like some more information on Planned Parenthood. Are they a non-profit organization? Yea, it's a recognized non profit. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Exactly, but the doctors get a salary, too, out of performing these opperations. I'd like some more information on Planned Parenthood. Are they a non-profit organization? Planned-Parent hood offers services that are paid through government funds, EXCEPT abortions. The funds for abortions are given by donation, they are not paid with tax-payer's money. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Here's the Planned Parenthood website. http://www.plannedparenthood.org/ Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 I don't know where you get your information from, but anti-abortionists don't just sit around rubbing their hands together and saying, "Oooh, let's see who we can force into our little schemes today." There is a reason we believe like we do, at least truly Christian anti-abortionists, and it is because we care about both mother and child. Most are giving of their money and time, unlike Planned-Parenthood and abortion clinics. If I'mnotsorry.net was working, I'd show you that. It has real life stories of woman who have gone to so called 'other option' councilers and had similar results. Also, Christian and other religious anti-abortionists are some of the worst offenders of womans rights. I don't mean to offend you or anything, but it sounds as though you are making an assumption. Not all anti-abortionists wish to lay guilt trips on expectant mothers, certainly not the ones I know. So if an expectant mother was ADAMANT about having an abortion and nothing the Christian anti-abortionists you know said to try and convince her otherwise, would they still deny her an abortion? From all of the news stories and websites I've read, most DO deny it. As for your statement about money, gee, I wonder how much the catholic/christian church rakes in for what they do. Hmmmm. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Planned-Parent hood offers services that are paid through government funds, EXCEPT abortions. The funds for abortions are given by donation, they are not paid with tax-payer's money. What services are our tax-dollars going too, then? To persuade scared young women that they need an abortion? I wonder that the government doesn't put more money into helping mothers raise children instead of persuading them that they need to get rid of them. Could you specify on how much it costs to have an abortion? Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 What services are our tax-dollars going too, then? To persuade scared young women that they need an abortion? I wonder that the government doesn't put more money into helping mothers raise children instead of persuading them that they need to get rid of them. Could you specify on how much it costs to have an abortion? Important services like general woman's health that may or may not have to do with pregnancy. I have never heard of someone trying to push someone into having an abortion. It's an option, not a dictatorship. The anti-abortionists, however, make their side to be a complete "don't do it or you're a terrible person". Abortion is an option, not an ultimatum. Because some mothers just shouldn't be mothers, and tossing a kid into the system as it is now is a lot more irresponsible than terminating at an early stage. I cannot, but I can assure you it's a heck of a lot cheaper than the costs of delivering a baby and caring for one. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 What services are our tax-dollars going too, then? To persuade scared young women that they need an abortion? I wonder that the government doesn't put more money into helping mothers raise children instead of persuading them that they need to get rid of them. No, Christian anti abortion fundies have that covered. :3 http://www.plannedparenthood.org/health-to...ndard-21507.htm As for costs: http://www.prochoice.org/pregnant/expect/costs.html Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) What services are our tax-dollars going too, then? To persuade scared young women that they need an abortion? I wonder that the government doesn't put more money into helping mothers raise children instead of persuading them that they need to get rid of them. Could you specify on how much it costs to have an abortion? It goes to teaching people about all of the options that they have, and no, they don't really pressure you into doing anything, they just give you the bare facts, even ont their Abortion page. "If you are pregnant, you have options. If you are trying to decide if abortion is the right choice for you, you probably have many things to think about. Learning the facts about abortion may help you in making your decision. You may also want to learn more about parenting and adoption." Here's an excerpt from their About Us page. "For more than 90 years, Planned Parenthood has promoted a commonsense approach to women’s health and well-being, based on respect for each individual’s right to make informed, independent decisions about health, sex, and family planning." Edit: And as for the cost of abortion, I'll look into that. Edit 2: From what I'm seeing, a 1st trimester abortion can run from $350-500, and a 2nd trimester is $600-1,000. Edited December 31, 2011 by ShadoWolf800 Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) What services are our tax-dollars going too, then? To persuade scared young women that they need an abortion? I wonder that the government doesn't put more money into helping mothers raise children instead of persuading them that they need to get rid of them. Could you specify on how much it costs to have an abortion? And maybe if we spent more money on sex-ed instead of abstinence-only education, we'd have less pregnancies in the first place. Since I'm Not Sorry isn't working, one of my favorite reads was The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion, though it has a slightly different subject matter. http://mypage.direct.ca/w/writer/anti-tales.html Edited December 31, 2011 by 7Deadly$ins Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 So if an expectant mother was ADAMANT about having an abortion and nothing the Christian anti-abortionists you know said to try and convince her otherwise, would they still deny her an abortion? From all of the news stories and websites I've read, most DO deny it. As for your statement about money, gee, I wonder how much the catholic/christian church rakes in for what they do. Hmmmm. Yikes! I was clicking for the "quote" button and I hit the "report" one instead. I hope it doesn't work unless you send in a complaint . In anycase, getting back on topic, it is true that they would most likely deny her the funds for an abortion since that is not what they're there for just as Planned Parenthood would deny her the funds to raise her child. As for Churches, I can assure you that most, yes there are some corrupt ones out there as in all things, put their money towards things such as feeding the starving both in other countries and in the U.S. as well as sending work teams to different parts of the country and the world. Occasionally they may expand the Church or put the money towards supplies, but this is mainly in order to expand their ministry. I have had first hand experience with this, too, having grown up in a family that is pretty involved in Church. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) In anycase, getting back on topic, it is true that they would most likely deny her the funds for an abortion since that is not what they're there for just as Planned Parenthood would deny her the funds to raise her child. Which means they are biased, not understanding of the woman's plight, and bigoted to boot. As for Churches, I can assure you that most, yes there are some corrupt ones out there as in all things, put their money towards things such as feeding the starving both in other countries and in the U.S. as well as sending work teams to different parts of the country and the world. Occasionally they may expand the Church or put the money towards supplies, but this is mainly in order to expand their ministry. I have had first hand experience with this, too, having grown up in a family that is pretty involved in Church. You seem to be under the impression that Planned Parenthood only supports abortion as a choice. That's wrong. They take care of woman regardless of their choices. I reccomend you actually read some of the links posted so you can grasp a better understanding of what they do. Also, Churches are partly to blame for the fact that abortions are needed in the first place. Edited December 31, 2011 by skinst Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Yikes! I was clicking for the "quote" button and I hit the "report" one instead. I hope it doesn't work unless you send in a complaint . In anycase, getting back on topic, it is true that they would most likely deny her the funds for an abortion since that is not what they're there for just as Planned Parenthood would deny her the funds to raise her child. As for Churches, I can assure you that most, yes there are some corrupt ones out there as in all things, put their money towards things such as feeding the starving both in other countries and in the U.S. as well as sending work teams to different parts of the country and the world. Occasionally they may expand the Church or put the money towards supplies, but this is mainly in order to expand their ministry. I have had first hand experience with this, too, having grown up in a family that is pretty involved in Church. I don't know about that. In my opinion "superchurches" are quite a prevalent problem, and they're everywhere. My closest church started out relatively small, and we attended it back when we went to regular services and I was Christian. Then they spent several million on building a new, larger church, two million of which was for a sound system alone. They didn't need that. I wish I could say this was an isolated incident but it really isn't as far as the average church seems to be going. There seems to be a fair bit of competition between them. Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 I know INS itself isn't working right now, but the Wayback Machine has at least a few pages archived. I'm not absolutely sure if the individual stories are there, but the FAQ page and some others are. Here are a few links: FAQ: http://web.archive.org/web/20100910121837/...about-abortion/ The why of the site: http://web.archive.org/web/20100317133456/...net/whythis.htm Links to stories (Hopefully this part works): http://web.archive.org/web/20100129085209/...toryarchive.htm Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) I don't think that the Church has any responsibility to support something that goes against their teachings, however they shouldn't stick their noses into non-followers business. Everyone has the freedom to choose, and they should be able to use it. And yes, please read the links provided. If there's one thing that's fact and not opinion in this thread its that Planned Parenthood doesn't push a pro-anything stance, but just gives information and financial help to those who need it. Edit - I apologize about the above, but I did some looking into and they do support a pro-choice agenda, though that doesn't correlate to a pro-abortion stance. They're two widely different things. You can choose to not have one, or have one, whichever you want. Edited December 31, 2011 by ShadoWolf800 Share this post Link to post
Posted December 31, 2011 Did a little research and I found this link which helps illustrate that not all pregnancy centers are out to make women feel guilty: https://www.care-net.org/ourwork/success_stories.php Share this post Link to post
Recommended Posts