Forever Eggs

[TPishek]

I, like many others here, would love to collect some of the site’s beautiful egg sprites on my scroll. I’ve read several threads debating egg freezing, the issues with freezing eggs, and possible alternatives to this, and I’m aware of many of the arguments. This is an idea I’ve had for a while; I haven’t seen anything quite like it in any of the threads I’ve read, so if it is a duplicate please don’t eat me. ._.

 

I’m sure most of the regular users here are aware of the “joke eggs” on the site, aka the egg and the <3 egg. These eggs go through all of the cracking stages, and then hatch-- into another egg. I was thinking about this one day, and it occurred to me that this process, modified for regular eggs, might make a good substitute for straight-out egg freezing, which has met with a lot of opposition.

• Issues identified with freezing eggs: since no effort at all has to be put in to grow an egg, unlike a hatchling, the action will be abused to clear out the AP; if an egg is lost in trade and frozen by the snatcher, there is no hope of getting it back even if the person wants to return it
• Issues identified with breeding infertile eggs: what if I don’t want an infertile egg and my dragon gives me one; what do we do for unbreedables, how does this affect ratios
• Issues identified with piecing hatched eggs back together: two-for-one isn’t quite fair
• Issues identified with collecting pieces of egg shells from the Cave: overly complicated?

How this idea addresses these problems:

 

The “Perpetuate” action (there’s probably a better word for this out there somewhere) would be performed on an egg with five or more days remaining. It can be used on any egg, whether CB, self-bred, or found on the AP. If the egg is abandoned at any point following this action (but before it hatches), the Perpetuation will be nullified, making it once again like any other egg, capable of growing up normally. If the Perpetuated egg is kept, it will still have to accumulate the same number of views as a normal egg and go through all of the cracking stages, as if it were going to turn into a hatchling; otherwise, it will die when it runs out of time. When the Perpetuated egg reaches the 3d 23h mark (or whenever it has enough views to progress), instead of hatching into a hatchling, it hatches into... another egg. The “time remaining” and the abandon action will disappear, and the egg will stop accumulating views and no longer take up an egg slot on the scroll. Maybe the egg could even be named or described. After this point, the egg (will cycle endlessly through the cracking stages without needing?)/will not need any more views to survive.

 

Since the egg still has to receive enough views to survive the first cracking, making it take as much effort to raise a Forever Egg as it does to raise a frozen hatchling, abuse in order to clear the AP could be avoided. In addition, since (1) abandoning the egg restores its ability to hatch normally, (2) the Perpetuation does not truly take hold until the egg completely “hatches” once, and (3) the egg must have at least 5 days remaining to use this action on it, there is opportunity for Lost in Trade eggs to be returned, since eggs cannot hatch until 3d 23h. Possibly, Incubate could even be disabled for Perpetuated eggs, to ensure that this 25-hour window will always remain.

 

This would also entirely circumvent the issues with breeding infertile eggs, and with piecing eggshells back together. (Additionally, people who want to collect each cracking stage would not have to freeze a bajillion eggs of each type to do so, since each egg would be all the cracking stages in one.)? Another advantage is that most of the coding already exists, as we can see in the joke eggs.

 

Two potential problems I can see would be first, the logic of it. It does say on the egg descriptions that “Unborn dragons are actually ready to hatch early on in their development cycle. However, they choose to remain in the safety of their own egg rather than leave it”; this to me provides a starting point for making this acceptable for the dragons. I can easily see that some hatchlings, out of stubbornness or timidity or perhaps pure laziness (lol) might want to just stay in their cozy little egg forever, and this action would provide the magic to make that possible. But, do they still need to eat? I assume frozen hatchlings still eat. Perhaps the cycle of cracking could be modified slightly so that during the first six days of the week, the egg goes through the various cracking stages, and on the seventh the hatchling briefly emerges to scavenge food before retreating to its egg again, regenerating the shell around itself. Purely brainstorming here, feel free to add your opinion. I know that obviously the joke eggs don’t have hatchlings that scavenge for food, but those eggs “do not actually exist” and neither do the hatchlings inside them, so I think that might be just a completely different case. :V

 

The other problem is that it might detract from the “specialness” of the joke eggs. On one hand, everyone would be able to have eggs that hatched back into eggs; on the other hand, no one would have the color-changing squigglies or the pretty pink heart. I think that aspect of it would be purely up to TJ. Another possibility is that after the first "hatching," which is essential to avoid abuse, the egg no longer cycles at all and is simply in a true frozen state (although this conflicts with the logic presented above).

 

Also, I think eggs with Perpetuate used on them should count towards the ratios, something that I know has been argued about before. It is alive, it’s just hiding! And it took the same amount of effort to raise it as it does to raise a frozen hatchling, which counts towards the ratios.

 

I think this would work well as a general Action, with a limit on it just like freezing for hatchlings, but I could also see it as a BSA... if so, I would propose it be given to the Nocturnes, since they are stuck in an endless cycle of their own. The spriters do not think this fits Nocturnes as a BSA. :3

 

TBD: Should the eggs cycle endlessly? Most people seem to be leaning away from this. What should the freeze limit (# of eggs) be? What time remaining on the egg should be the limit be (eg 5 days)?

Edited May 5, 2010 by TPishek

[Ryukotsusei]

I love this idea, and I also think it particularly suits the Nocturnes to have a BSA like this.

 

I don't have any solutions to the logic issues you mentioned, but it does take care of a lot of the other arguments people were presenting with the other solutions. I would love to see an idea like this implemented.

[Kanakha]

Big post maek brain go boom @______@

 

I like the idea. The fact that one wouldn't have to 'freeze' the egg would take away the risk of maxing out our total freezing allowances. I've always wanted to keep eggs on my scroll without them hatching or dying. +1 supports.

[chickenhound]

XP i still like the infertile eggs or egg pieces best

[DragonNeko]

I love this idea, and I also think it particularly suits the Nocturnes to have a BSA like this.

Neko agrees!

[Wookieinmashoo]

Neko agrees!

yeah...this one seems a little much. Well thought out, but still a bit much ._.

 

Though I'd have to say, if you had one of these eggs for say a month...then abandoned it and another person caught and hatched it...then the stealing/breeding times would be way off from the hatching times.

 

Also, just wondering...would you have to take care of this egg forever? I wouldn't want to have to continually take care of an egg that just hatches into another egg. I don't know how TJ does it.

Edited April 19, 2010 by Wookieinmashoo

[libby2999]

Iv seen some other threads like this. like unfirtle eggs, or something like that and everytime i supported it. So I support it.

[TPishek]

Though I'd have to say, if you had one of these eggs for say a month...then abandoned it and another person caught and hatched it...then the stealing/breeding times would be way off from the hatching times.

 

Also, just wondering...would you have to take care of this egg forever? I wouldn't want to have to continually take care of an egg that just hatches into another egg. I don't know how TJ does it.

After it hatches the first time, after 3 days of taking care of it like any other egg, it can no longer be abandoned, and it no longer needs any more views.

 

(It's in the giant wall'o'text somewhere, I swear )

 

I know TJ's keeps requiring views to stay alive, but that's because it's TJ's It's famous, so it almost always gets enough views just from people looking it up to see what color it is today, and plus if it died he could just revive it. We don't have that luxury, so I don't think it would be AT ALL practical to have to keep giving these guys views after they hatch the first time.

[Silarava]

I am a regular user, and yet I have never seen a joke egg....

 

beside the point, though. I agree with this idea, though the infertile egg or the collecting egg shell pieces sounds cool too....*looks around for gold or silver dragon egg pieces* though that may be the problem, depending on if the egg shell is put down if the egg hatches or dies...

 

*head explodes* I think too much *can almost hear brother saying it over and over again* As I was saying, that might make the rare dragons less and less rare, and where would be the fun of hunting them down?......

 

Yes, I am done now...

[WestWindReborn]

really love this idea, but maybe not have it constantly cycling through the cracking? maybe the forever eggs can cave an option to stop the cracking at whatever point its at?

[dragonsroc989]

this is a really well thought out idea and I add my support =D

[Geobreeder]

The only trouble I see is simular to why TJ09 won't allow unfreezing. Frozen hatchies are past their sell by date and therefore if unfrozen would instantly die. However since its resetting all the time it might not be a problem.

[Fiona]

Geo, I don't understand your objection. Once the egg gets past it's hatch time, it can't be unfrozen or abandoned, according to the original post. There's no need to worry about it being out of time. The proposal was that the egg could only still be abandoned until it would normally have hatched.

 

This seems like a sensible way to address all the previous objections. And I had this vision of the baby dragon sticking a nose out of the opening of the egg when it's at the large hole stage and snatching a bite to eat and then retreating back into its haven. Cute mental picture, so thanks for that.

[Amazon_warrior]

H'mmmmmmm.

 

Would the frozen eggs count towards breed ratios or not? I understood that that was also a potential sticking point. Would the Perpetuate function have a limit on it like freezing does? Can we release frozen eggs into the Wilderness if we can't abandon them to the AP? (Note: I almost never release my dragons at any stage, but some ppl do.)

[calankh]

it seems like with the freezing limit, there's no need to worry about 'abuse' of an ability to freeze eggs--you can only do 10 every two weeks anyway. This seems way more complicated than the piecing eggs back together idea, also.

[TPishek]

H'mmmmmmm.

 

Would the frozen eggs count towards breed ratios or not?  I understood that that was also a potential sticking point.  Would the Perpetuate function have a limit on it like freezing does?  Can we release frozen eggs into the Wilderness if we can't abandon them to the AP?  (Note:  I almost never release my dragons at any stage, but some ppl do.)

Yes, yes (or be a BSA with a cooldown), and yes.

 

 

it seems like with the freezing limit, there's no need to worry about 'abuse' of an ability to freeze eggs--you can only do 10 every two weeks anyway. This seems way more complicated than the piecing eggs back together idea, also.

It really isn't that complicated, I think, it just seems that way because longpost is looong. I was trying to show how it could address other issues, and some of the issues with it, but the action itself boils down to:

 

1) Use Perpetuate on an egg

2) Put egg on fansites / wherever you normally post it

3) If you abandon it before it hatches, the Perpetuate is no longer active; it goes back to being a normal egg.

4) If you keep it, then after it "hatches" (back into an egg) it becomes a Forever egg.

 

The rest is details that need to get worked out.

[JOTB]

Hrm. . .my only problem with this is that if I was collecting an egg because I thought it looked pretty, I don't want there to be a big gaping hole in it half the time. Does it necessarily have to cycle through the hatching stages over and over and over again?

 

 

[TPishek]

Hrm. . .my only problem with this is that if I was collecting an egg because I thought it looked pretty, I don't want there to be a big gaping hole in it half the time. Does it necessarily have to cycle through the hatching stages over and over and over again?

Naw, that's something I'd like to discuss in this thread. My original idea included this because it was inspired by the joke eggs; however, I'm not sure it's necessary.

[Demis]

I love this idea I also love the idea of having it be a nocturne BSA, as i see them in the AP a lot (not like the greens, but enough of them) and it does match them well, as they are, indeed, stuck in a cycle of their own. I love the waterrhorse eggs, and split eggs, and vamp eggs, and would love to have some as forever eggs I wholeheartedly support this!

P.S. you should make a banner, as i would SO sport it! maybe of an egg hatching over and over into different eggs? crack, crack, crack, Green! crack, crack, crack, Blue!

[Pokemonfan13]

Hrm. . .my only problem with this is that if I was collecting an egg because I thought it looked pretty, I don't want there to be a big gaping hole in it half the time. Does it necessarily have to cycle through the hatching stages over and over and over again?

This. If I collect eggs I want them to be uncracked. I'm just not interested in collecting eggs that will have cracks/holes in them 90% of the time.

[rubyshoes]

Hrm. . .my only problem with this is that if I was collecting an egg because I thought it looked pretty, I don't want there to be a big gaping hole in it half the time. Does it necessarily have to cycle through the hatching stages over and over and over again?

This. Except for the magma egg, I really don't care to see the hatching stages.

[dragon_mando]

Hrm. . .my only problem with this is that if I was collecting an egg because I thought it looked pretty, I don't want there to be a big gaping hole in it half the time. Does it necessarily have to cycle through the hatching stages over and over and over again?

This.

 

Otherwise, full support ^-^

[Amazon_warrior]

This.

 

Otherwise, full support ^-^

Yup, same here. Man, I would collect so many Waterwalker eggs. The actual dragons don't do a lot for me personally, but the eggs are pure awesome.

[HeatherMarie]

I *still* don't see why regular freezing is so controversial when it comes to eggs. I honestly don't get the arguments about "killing the dragon inside" or whatever... I mean, freezing hatchlings doesn't kill the hatchling, so why would freezing an egg be any different? IMO the dragon would simply live inside the egg forever, kinda frozen like the hatchlings are so it doesn't get any bigger.

 

tl;dr (is that how you do it?), I don't get why something so different/complicated is needed when simple freezing would be so much easier.

[Corteo]

Both Hypnotic and I would like to say that we do not want the nocturnes used for this.