AP: 1 line of non-Holiday during Holidays

[Thuban]

A thread for non holidays for the holidays would be the most simple solution of all, imo.

 

I honestly don't want to see anyone's common, bred eggs during a holiday event. A thread made specifically for them would be, imo, ideal and satisfy everyone. If such a thread generated vast interest and non holidays were being snapped up left and right during holiday events, then add a line of non holiday eggs if there was that much interest. I just don't see a huge interest in them being the norm myself, and a specific thread for them would prove it one way or the other.

Which then forces Non forum using users, to have to use the forums to find those non grab-able eggs locked behind the wall of stuff they dont want to catch. I HATE trading on the forums. Its one long waiting game of playing tag and hoping people actually read what you were looking for and actually offered them. My kids are NOT allowed on the forum, but still enjoy AP hunting, and can not do so while holiday things are in effect, due to the walls. Outside of the chat, they have no other means of trading, since they arent ready for a forum setting.

 

 

Some of us have pretty huge reasons for not wanting to collect holidays. We have a decent sized userbase of people who DONT like the constant baby pink and girly flow of v-days, who prefer to be able to play normally, instead of being forced to either stop playing until the wall goes away, stare at a cave full of eggs they can only have 2 of for three days or hope theres a slow point where nobody is breeding the holidays so they can try to hunt the ap normally.

 

I have no interest in collecting old holidays. I breed my own holidays to start my lines, and only want commons from other peoples lines. During the holidays, I look for the non holiday eggs people bred to be nice, the common mates for potential holiday pairings that people dropped a few days before the event (giving them a chance to breed again on said holiday for their holiday sprites). I love stockpiling super common hatchys that people complain about blocking the cave (my balloon hoard started on the tail end of v-day a couple years ago). Almost every hoard I have started as me grabbing a bunch of commons out during breeding lulls in the ap during holidays.

 

There are a lot of new players, who start right before, or during events, those users could use the advantage of attempting to snag those same low time BSA eggs that the rest of us have had time to stockpile. Some users, the ap during holiday is their only shot at catching rares and such for themselves, since the normal people who snag them up are busy finding high value holiday sprites instead. I mean.. This years prizes have been handed out, and theres a good chance they will all end up bred to v-day sprites, so your hunters will be out there trying to hunt those, instead of the potentially messy gold eggs they would get the rest of the year.

 

 

This request doesn't hurt anything involving the holiday events. All it does is give those of us who have no desire to really take part, to continue to play as we would NORMALLY. Holidays arent going to die in the AP.. just the things that people have no access to, to pick up.

 

 

 

[purplehaze]

I really do not understand why there is resistance to this idea! No one is proposing that the holiday eggs have to sit behind a wall of non-holiday eggs (or if someone perhaps did it is certainly not the intent of the OP of this suggestion or a majority of its supporters.) All that is being asked for here is a chance for people who want to get regular breeds from the AP during holiday breeding to be able to do so and for eggs that were bred before holiday breeding even started to have a chance to be picked up before they die!

 

The problem with a trade thread is that it forces anyone who wants a non-holiday egg to get it from the trade threads. For many of us who seldom venture into the trade arena and for non-forum members, that forces a major change in our play style. This suggestion allows for all different play styles to be accommodated without interfering with any other play style. It hurts no one!

 

On another note, in all due respect Fuzz, I do not believe that it is possible for eggs to die on the AP if the eggs that are showing are regular non-holiday breeds at 5 or 6 days. Any egg that is close to dying would be moved ahead of those eggs in the queue if those eggs are all non-holidays. So how can there be low-time eggs dying there? The only eggs I have ever seen die on the AP are non-holidays that are caught behind the wall of holiday eggs and never get to see the light of day.

[Fuzzbucket]

Erm ... you seem to mix up what I've been saying. Or you mean something else by "mixed" than I do.

 

Of COURSE, with the past 2 holiday seasons, regular eggs died behind the holiday wall because there was NO row for them.

There has been no mixing at all during those 2 holidays, just a wall of holidays and nothing else.

 

No, they would NOT. They would *all* be sorted by timer, just like the regular AP. The lower their timer, the further they get to the front - be they holiday or regular eggs. Whatever people can massbreed, at some point, the remaining holiday eggs would show up before them because their timer is lower - and people would snag them up.

What you are saying is not actually true for a *mixed* AP, it would be true if holiday eggs were hidden *behind* regular eggs - and that would be even more horrible than a mixed AP

No - this has nothing to do with the holiday wall. What I am saying - and what Sock also said - is that eggs do die in the AP. Not just around holidays - all the time. You have at least implied - more than once - that egg death in the AP only happens at holidays or if they are dumped there with loads of views. I have known pf several eggs that landed there with no views - autoed or unwanted CBs - that simply died. Any old time of year.

 

Sure it is worse if there is a huge holiday wall - but it happens all year. So saying eggs only die behind a holiday wall and that's why we need this, to SAVE them, as at other times they'd make it and be picked up is not true. I agree with a line of non-holiday eggs - I am just saying that eggs DO die in the AP at other times.

 

I see a cross post. @ purplehaze - all I know is that death has on occasion happened to a couple of eggs of mine that have autoed. Not at holiday time.

[amthystfire]

Ok. I am going to repeat my request for someone against this suggestion to articulately explain to me why they are against it.

 

I seriously do not understand. The best that I have really seen is that "I don't want to," and "Holidays are special, let those other eggs die, they shouldn't have been bred."

 

So, we are 4-7 days out from the start of holiday breeding, which means that some eggs being bred TODAY would possibly be showing up in the AP after breeding for the Holiday starts. So, if I wanted to AP breed my Flamingos or Guardians, It's too late? I don't think that we should have to reset our schedules just because of what might happen during the upcoming holiday, and seriously, if I wasn't participating in this thread, I wouldn't have thought about it this far out from the actual holiday. (not that I do a lot of AP bombing, I prefer to gift individually)

[cyradis4]

Eggs bred today will be fine. They'll hit the AP in 2.5 days or so. But anything bred after the 5th is probably in danger, and anything bred later than the 7th is in serious danger.

 

Cheers!

C4.

[amthystfire]

Eggs bred today will be fine. They'll hit the AP in 2.5 days or so. But anything bred after the 5th is probably in danger, and anything bred later than the 7th is in serious danger.

 

Cheers!

C4.

I was going based on this: https://dragcave.net/lineage/TtViG

 

Rosebud I picked up last year. I have not chosen a mate for her yet (and considering her lineage, I don't think I will until it is time) so she has her original date: February 8, 2014. This is possibly variable (I have heard that it isn't totally set) so if this is the day that breeding opens, yes, we have 5 days, but if it opens a day or so early, eggs that were expected to be fine won't be. So, to be safe, someone might not breed from now until the Holiday eggs are cleared. (this is only my second Valentine's so I am far from an expert, and the novelty of the whole thing wears off for me after about three hours.)

 

But I digress. It is what it is, and my point was that if I wasn't involved in a discussion of breeding cycles, I wouldn't think twice about breeding on the 7th, that's still a week out from Valentine's, and it is not an immediate concern as a person. And tossing something into the AP at that point would get just as little thought, then, boom, the breeding season opens up for them holiday, and that egg you might have intended to keep is now tossed in favor of egg space for the holiday, and while someone might pick it up if they see it, the problem is that they aren't likely to see it.

[Ha-Ki]

No - this has nothing to do with the holiday wall. What I am saying - and what Sock also said - is that eggs do die in the AP. Not just around holidays - all the time. You have at least implied - more than once - that egg death in the AP only happens at holidays or if they are dumped there with loads of views. I have known pf several eggs that landed there with no views - autoed or unwanted CBs - that simply died. Any old time of year.

If you're talking about the same statement by Sock I think you're talking about, I think you've misread it. The conversation I recall was this (link):

 

I mostly support, but I also worry about eggs that get trapped behind holiday walls. Without the added day, many more would die.

They don't die, they hatch and go to the wilderness or there's a stop on the timer or so I thought

Nope, they do die. Perhaps on holidays, the AP could be worked to do the normal 5 lines that fill with holidays/any backlog if there's room and then do one extra line which doesn't hold any holidays?

 

I really can't imagine how an egg in the AP could die from lack of views outside of holidays. The eggs with the lowest timer go to the front of the queue, so we should be able to see eggs with 0d 1h left if that happened. Are you sure those eggs died in the AP, and not on some newbie's scroll that doesn't display the user name? Or maybe they were failed ND experiments and some experimenter forgot to unfog them in time?

If what you say does indeed happen, it needs fixing and should get its own thread.

[cyradis4]

I really can't imagine how an egg in the AP could die from lack of views outside of holidays. The eggs with the lowest timer go to the front of the queue, so we should be able to see eggs with 0d 1h left if that happened. Are you sure those eggs died in the AP, and not on some newbie's scroll that doesn't display the user name? Or maybe they were failed ND experiments and some experimenter forgot to unfog them in time?

If what you say does indeed happen, it needs fixing and should get its own thread.

While its theoretically possible, I don't think it'll actually happen.

 

More likely, what you'd end up with is a pissed-off userbase. Because they'd have to grab those ER eggs, hatch them, and toss them back to the AP to clear it to get to the Holidays.

 

Cheers!

C4.

[Ha-Ki]

More likely, what you'd end up with is a pissed-off userbase. Because they'd have to grab those ER eggs, hatch them, and toss them back to the AP to clear it to get to the Holidays.

Nope, only if they mix. If only holidays are displayed in up to 4 rows and only non-holidays in one row, both parts of the AP could have different timers.

 

My post above was slightly off-topic and not referring to the suggestion, but to AP-behavior outside holidays since that discussion came up. Sorry for the confusion.

 

 

Edit @ topic: I made an image how this would look like. Screenshots taken from the screenshot thread, CL and ER eggs. Feel free to add this to the OP.

 

 

Explanation: The AP is split in two zones, with the greater one dedicated to holidays.

 

The upper 4 rows will be exactly like the AP we had last Halloween and last Christmas. Holiday eggs get priority and appear first in the AP. If there's not enough eggs to make a wall, the other spaces in this zone will be filled by regular eggs, just as it was last holidays. If there are more than 24 holiday eggs awaiting adoption, they will form a solid wall that fills the upper 4 rows completely with holidays. All holiday eggs starting from number 25 are in the holiday zone backlog and invisible.

 

The last row will never display holidays, but only regular eggs and hatchies. To make this possible, the timers in this zone will be independant from the timers in the other zone. The eggs that are displayed are still sorted by time, of course, with the lowest timer on the left.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Ha-Ki

[amthystfire]

A visual will probably be helpful to some, thank you, Ha-ki.

[Tigerkralle]

Great work Ha-Ki.

 

That is what i imagine when i read the suggestion.

[Jazeki]

 

This is the other suggestion that C4 had, either one or two lines after the normal amount. Screenshots also came from the same threads as Ha-Ki's visual.

Edited February 4, 2015 by Jazeki

[Mondat]

idk if this is really needed.  every holiday i've experienced here at DC at some point during the day the normal eggs end up showing up anyways; and the closer you get towards the end of the holiday, the less holiday eggs appear in the cave.

 

 

iirc for Christmas, by the 3rd day, you had holiday eggs limited to the first 3 rows majority of the day.

I'm going to take screenshots this Valentine (if this does not get implemented until then ). I also interestingly remember that I had some "where are the holiday eggs?" moments during holiday breeding seasons. Where holiday eggs showed up in the first row (top left) only and didn't even fill it.

 

[Prince_Xanthius]

I definitely support this; there's no reason not to have some ability to pick up normal AP eggs during the holiday period, especially since so many die behind the wall. I'd prefer to just keep one line clear rather than add lines, but that's just personal preference.

[Cinnamin Draconna]

I support the idea of there being 1 line of eggs reserved for non-holiday eggs on the AP.

 

I do not support adding an additional line to the AP.

 

Adding a line to the AP would put that non-holiday line half-way off my screen, requiring me to scroll down to see the additional line.

[AnanoKimi]

I'm going to take screenshots this Valentine (if this does not get implemented until then ). I also interestingly remember that I had some "where are the holiday eggs?" moments during holiday breeding seasons. Where holiday eggs showed up in the first row (top left) only and didn't even fill it.

Its only for those moments when the AP is walled by holidays. It would only kick in when there are tons of eggs so that just in case that happens, even if it lasts only a few minutes, other users can still keep catching regular AP eggs.

[purplehaze]

I would not like to see an extra row of eggs, either. Just allow for one line of regular eggs among the lines already there, please. I would have to scroll down to see an extra line, too, on my laptop which is what I use at least 99% of the time.

[amthystfire]

I would not like to see an extra row of eggs, either. Just allow for one line of regular eggs among the lines already there, please. I would have to scroll down to see an extra line, too, on my laptop which is what I use at least 99% of the time.

Hrmm. I think I was the one who mentioned the extra row in the first place, unless it was in the OP (I'm too lazy to go look ATM) but is there anyone who really supports that OVER repurposing the bottom row as exclusive non-holiday territory? I am kind of in the "either way would work for me" group, so I like the idea of non-holiday territory, I'm just not picky as to whether that would be in the 5th or (New) 6th row.

 

So, four groups: No, don't want; Yes, only repurposed row; Yes, new row; or yes, whatever. (I belong to the last group of course, but I am curious as to how many are in the third group, it doesn't seem like many.

[Ribombee]

I would love this, actually. I have 2Gs in most most of the holidays I need. The only thing I would be hunting for is neat lineages or extra ones to add to current lineages, so if I spotted something nice and low time in the non-holiday line, I would definitely grab it.

[Red2111]

I'm not ignoring your main point: I refuted it.

 

The reason people aren't catching the eggs before they die is because the eggs are not showing up to be grabbed.

 

By the time day 5 rolled around, the eggs in the backlog were nearly ER. That means they had 4 days left. And then they were hidden for over 4 days behind a wall of Holidays. They were running out of time. When the Holiday wall finally cleared at the end of Day 8 (I was watching it out of curiosity), the normal eggs behind it had less than an hour. That means there were eggs dieing in the backlog. Granted, given the timing, it probably wasn't a huge amount this past Christmas.

 

And remember: that extra day to make them 4 days? Is not added until the first time they show up in the AP. So those right behind eggs that were showing at 4 days when the wall formed had 3 days left until they died. Then they were hidden for 4 days. So a day's worth of eggs died.

 

At Halloween, it was much, much worse.

 

Eggs dieing isn't a big deal, but there are people who want those eggs. So since making it so they can get access to them doesn't affect the Holiday catchers, why not?

 

Cheers!

C4.

no you're still missing my point and didn't even acknowledge it, let alone refute it.

 

my point is that people during the holidays are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs

 

that people use their incubates and scroll limits for holiday eggs

 

and that people hunting in the AP are there for Holiday eggs

 

 

the issue is that is being address here is non-holiday ap eggs being killed because the holiday eggs are blocking them.

 

my point is that even if we had only 1 row of holiday eggs those ap eggs would still die because people would still be focusing on holiday eggs and saving their scroll space and incubates for holiday eggs.

 

1% of the people in the AP would be there for non-holiday eggs. while 99% of us would continue to ignore the non-holidays until after holiday eggs stopped dropping.

 

 

the better option would be for TJ to extend the time on the non-holiday eggs a few days during the holiday season so they dont really hit the AP until mid week when holiday breeding is slowing down and regular eggs would start mixing in naturally.

[SolarCat]

no you're still missing my point and didn't even acknowledge it, let alone refute it.

 

my point is that people during the holidays are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs

 

that people use their incubates and scroll limits for holiday eggs

 

and that people hunting in the AP are there for Holiday eggs

 

 

the issue is that is being address here is non-holiday ap eggs being killed because the holiday eggs are blocking them.

 

my point is that even if we had only 1 row of holiday eggs those ap eggs would still die because people would still be focusing on holiday eggs and saving their scroll space and incubates for holiday eggs.

 

1% of the people in the AP would be there for non-holiday eggs. while 99% of us would continue to ignore the non-holidays until after holiday eggs stopped dropping.

 

 

the better option would be for TJ to extend the time on the non-holiday eggs a few days during the holiday season so they dont really hit the AP until mid week when holiday breeding is slowing down and regular eggs would start mixing in naturally.

Except that once eggs become incu-hatchable they will absolutely be snapped up. So once the AP eggs are below 5 days, they'll start to move again, rather than die.

 

I know I would pick up and hatch many of them, even though I will be primarily hunting for holidays.

 

EDIT: Typo, blasted autocorrect, fixed!

Edited February 4, 2015 by SolarCat

[amthystfire]

no you're still missing my point and didn't even acknowledge it, let alone refute it.

 

my point is that people during the holidays are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs

 

that people use their incubates and scroll limits for holiday eggs

 

and that people hunting in the AP are there for Holiday eggs

 

 

the issue is that is being address here is non-holiday ap eggs being killed because the holiday eggs are blocking them.

 

my point is that even if we had only 1 row of holiday eggs those ap eggs would still die because people would still be focusing on holiday eggs and saving their scroll space and incubates for holiday eggs.

 

1% of the people in the AP would be there for non-holiday eggs. while 99% of us would continue to ignore the non-holidays until after holiday eggs stopped dropping.

 

 

the better option would be for TJ to extend the time on the non-holiday eggs a few days during the holiday season so they dont really hit the AP until mid week when holiday breeding is slowing down and regular eggs would start mixing in naturally.

During the holiday some people are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs.

 

During the holiday some people are saving their incubates for holiday eggs. I have ONE HUNDRED THREE Red dragons and rarely get through the first third when incubating stuff. Incuhatching during the holiday would be more of a challenge for me to actually use all these instead of letting them sit there.

 

And if there are 10,000 cave users (the last number that I heard being bandied about during the raffle discussion) then so what if only 100 of them are AP hunting for non-holiday eggs? that would probably be enough to stave off most of the issues with eggs dying and if they were mostly tossing them back, or even if half of them were tossing them back as hatchlings, then lo and behold, long about the 18th or so as the cave goes back to normal, the AP is suddenly filled with the hatchies that were tossed back. Win-win.

 

I am chosing to refute both of your main points by saying that you are describing your play style and that IT IS NOT THE ONLY PLAY STYLE OUT THERE, and I don't think that as many people play like you as you think do.

 

 

LOL, ETA: 'd by someone more succinct than I am. I do admit to being long-winded.

Edited February 4, 2015 by amthystfire

[AnanoKimi]

no you're still missing my point and didn't even acknowledge it, let alone refute it.

 

my point is that people during the holidays are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs

 

that people use their incubates and scroll limits for holiday eggs

 

and that people hunting in the AP are there for Holiday eggs

 

 

the issue is that is being address here is non-holiday ap eggs being killed because the holiday eggs are blocking them.

 

my point is that even if we had only 1 row of holiday eggs those ap eggs would still die because people would still be focusing on holiday eggs and saving their scroll space and incubates for holiday eggs.

 

1% of the people in the AP would be there for non-holiday eggs. while 99% of us would continue to ignore the non-holidays until after holiday eggs stopped dropping.

 

 

the better option would be for TJ to extend the time on the non-holiday eggs a few days during the holiday season so they dont really hit the AP until mid week when holiday breeding is slowing down and regular eggs would start mixing in naturally.

No she did refute it by saying there are people who want those eggs.

 

Not everyone is saving space for holiday eggs

Not everyone is saving incubates for holiday eggs.

Not everyone is hunting the AP for holiday eggs.

 

Some, maybe a good majority are, but not everyone So keep that in mind. You might, MidevalMystic might, Mondat might be hunting for holidays, but Thuban, Me, and others are hunting for regular eggs most of the time. So no not everyone is focused on holiday eggs other than the CB drop.

[cyradis4]

no you're still missing my point and didn't even acknowledge it, let alone refute it.

 

my point is that people during the holidays are saving their egg and scroll space for holiday eggs

 

that people use their incubates and scroll limits for holiday eggs

 

and that people hunting in the AP are there for Holiday eggs

 

 

the issue is that is being address here is non-holiday ap eggs being killed because the holiday eggs are blocking them.

 

my point is that even if we had only 1 row of holiday eggs those ap eggs would still die because people would still be focusing on holiday eggs and saving their scroll space and incubates for holiday eggs.

 

1% of the people in the AP would be there for non-holiday eggs. while 99% of us would continue to ignore the non-holidays until after holiday eggs stopped dropping.

 

 

the better option would be for TJ to extend the time on the non-holiday eggs a few days during the holiday season so they dont really hit the AP until mid week when holiday breeding is slowing down and regular eggs would start mixing in naturally.

Your point is invalid. People have been posting in this thread from the moment I put it up that they would catch the normal eggs. That they don't want to hunt holidays at all! So there, on every page of this thread, is proof positive that invalidates your argument that every person is doing the holiday-event.

 

For that matter, I'd probably even catch-incubate-hatch-tossback some! I have well over 100 Reds. Its been a very, very, very long time since I managed to come anywhere close to using all of them. And once the AP dropped below 4 days, I wouldn't even need that incubate!

 

With the hatcheries hopping at Christmas time, a gold scroll user could probably hatch and toss back 7 eggs every 5 minutes or so. That's 84 eggs every hour. I wouldn't do that, but I'm just staying that it could be done. And at that rate, it'd only take a half dozen or so people to push the AP's time back up.

 

There are, I've heard, over 10,000 people in the cave (1st raffle numbers 4 years ago, posted by TJ). It would only take a small fraction of that total to keep the AP times higher than 0d 0h.... IF the eggs are visible. The reason they've died in the past is that normal eggs are behind a wall long enough to drive them down to 0d 0h.

 

Cheers!

C4

[FiveSix]

I would absolutely adore an opportunity to pick up non-holiday eggs, especially at Valentine's. I'd prefer it to be the last existing row but an extra row would work for me.

 

I plan to pick up maybe four total Valentine's eggs this year, and had the same plan for Christmas. I'd like to have something else to look after while I wait for the holiday to pass by - at Christmas I picked up holiday eggs I didn't especially need because all my plans were stalled by holiday eggs being the only things available and I wanted something to do.